#170 - Rapids to round Ireland with Wild Atlantic Warrior Jon Hynes encore

WEBVTT

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Welcome to Paddling the Blue. With each episode, we talk with guests from the

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Great Lakes and around the globe who are doing cool things related to sea kayaking.

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I'm your host, my name is John Chase, and let's get started paddling the blue.

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Welcome to today's episode of the Paddling the Blue podcast.

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Today's release is an encore episode from the archives of a really fun conversation with John Hines.

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And John is someone who is truly living life to the fullest.

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Every social media post has a smile on his face, exploring new things and old

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favorites, and always finding ways to help others.

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He's the epitome of an adventure athlete and all-around good person.

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Before we get through our chat with John, James Stevenson and Simon Osborne

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at OnlineSeaKyaking.com continue to produce great content to help you evolve

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as a paddler and as a coach.

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And you'll find everything from basic strokes and safety to paddling in tides,

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surfing, coaching, documentaries, expedition skills, and incident management, and more.

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here is your opportunity to get started.

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Just visit OnlineSeaKhiking.com, use the coupon code PTBpodcast at checkout,

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And while you're there, be sure to visit the community section where you'll

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find an interview with me. Big thanks to Simon and Daniel for hosting me on one of their meetups.

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And for those of us who also enjoy paddling whitewater boats,

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please be sure to check out OnlineWhitewater.com. They're offering the same

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discount to listeners with that same code PTBpodcast to check out.

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And I'd love to help you put those skills to work. I offer a wide range of programs

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in the Great Lakes and beyond from paddling skill development,

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instructor certifications, workshops, CPR and wilderness first aid, guided trips, and more.

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And there's still lots of time left in 2026, and I'm currently working on the

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2027 calendar. So let me know what you'd like to see, and we'll see if we can

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make it happen together.

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Visit paddlingtheblue.com, click the Courses and Trips link at the top of the

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page, and I hope to see you on the water.

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I hope you really enjoy today's Encore episode with John Hines. He's a great guy.

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Hello, John. Welcome to Paddling the Blue. Hello, John.

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It's really, really nice to talk to you, and it's a real pleasure to meet you

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on the podcast. Yes, I appreciate the opportunity.

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So you've had quite an extensive experience in both sea kayaks and whitewater

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kayaks, and I know you started, I think you started as a whitewater kayaker, is that right?

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Yeah, little did I know my early childhood formative experiences and some really

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basic kayaking that would take me to where it has over the, what is it,

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the last 38 years now and really, really,

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look back at those childhood experiences with a lot of funness,

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particularly some great role models and mentors in Limerick Canoe Club who kind

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of took this young guy under the wing and brought him everywhere for a while.

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So what was it about paddling that attracted you as a youngster?

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Well, I grew up in a kind of a rural setting in County Limerick and,

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you know, running across fields and climbing trees was quite normal as a child.

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But I have a very vivid memory of my cousin, James.

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He was a very successful cable paddler.

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And my uncle, John, used to bring me to watch him race in the famous Liffey Descent.

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And I remember looking at it going, I have to do that. So after badgering my

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parents for a while, they finally phoned up the local canoe club and And they

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took me on and away I went.

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And I also had a lot of childhood experiences in the scout movement and some

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brilliant adventures at tents and, you know, exploring coastline and so on.

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So that really cemented a love of the water.

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I suppose the other thing that was really formative was my parents used to bring

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me on holidays to West Gork to a place called Skull every summer.

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And early morning boat trips, catching mackerel, climbing rocks,

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and eventually getting my own kayak.

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Those memories are pretty vivid these days.

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Wonderful. And they've brought you to where you are today.

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So during your youth, you had quite an extensive whitewater paddling experience,

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I understand. So tell us a little bit about where that took you.

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Yeah, that's right. When I got into outdoor education, I did a year-long training

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course and pretty quickly I found, oh, you can work as an instructor.

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And I'd never really realized that when I was in secondary school.

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So once I got into that, I got a job in a well-known outdoor center here called

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Capinalee Outdoor Education Center.

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And it's in a beautiful part of southwest Ireland in Kerry.

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And I was lucky enough to hit that center at a time when there were many other

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brilliant outdoor people.

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And we were kayaking before work during work and after work and we just lived

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and breathed kayaking for a long time so I had the kind of good fortune to be

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in the right place at the right time and I was really motivated to push myself hard,

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so I got into freestyle kayaking I was chasing rainwater all over Ireland and

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pretty soon then that led to trips abroad and,

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spent many many summer seasons in the French Alps.

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I've been to Nepal on many trips, the Zambezi, and just a lot of really hardcore adventures.

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And then taking responsibility for people on those trips as well was something I really enjoyed.

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It wasn't always the easiest of jobs, I might add. And, you know,

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we had a fair few bumps and scrapes along the way, but I really,

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really enjoyed that phase of life. So it's interesting.

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So what made the switch to sea kayaking for you? I won't say it was instant,

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but I certainly remember my boss at the time, Donald Dowd.

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He came up to me one day at work. I was only a young guy at the time and I thought

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I knew it all about kayaking, how naive I was.

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And he said, what are you doing for your summer holiday? And I said, I don't really know.

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He says, well, do you want to come sea kayaking on the west coast of Ireland?

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And without realizing what that meant, I just said yes. And whoa,

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did I have a baptism of fire on that week.

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Our first day crossing out Dinnish Boffin was in massive seas in this ocean

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cockpit, Nordkap that I'd never paddled before with a fixed gag and tons of gear.

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So, but he knew enough to push me into my outer adventure zone,

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but not push me past that.

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And that week was just the most amazing experience.

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So that was the first time I guess I became aware of the environment and the

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power of the coastline, the dynamics of the sea, the beauty of the nature,

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and also the pristine nature of our coastline.

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And it took me a while more to kind of wash the whitewater phase out of my career.

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And, you know, sometimes that had big landmarks in it with the odd bit of tragedy as well.

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So there was kind of a natural turn when my first daughter was born, Aoife.

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And I kind of pushed the kayaking as far, the whitewater as far as I wanted to go.

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And then sea kayaking just began

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to consume me after that. And I've not turned away from it ever since.

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So I'm curious, before going on that first sea kayaking trip,

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what was your perception of sea kayaking?

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I knew there was something special there. The idea of expedition was something

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that I was really curious about, but I didn't really have the knowledge or the

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skill set yet to kind of embark on that.

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So it was really, I was relying on the likes of Donald to kind of showcase or

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show me the way on that. But my perception was curiosity and that it,

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it perhaps at the time appealed to the elder paddler, which I was quickly corrected on.

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So what surprised you most on that trip?

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Well, I suppose the youthful naivety thought, oh, I can handle myself on a grade

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four or grade five rapid.

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But usually if you swim in one of those rapids, you can hopefully swim out quick

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enough. But when you're a couple of miles out to sea and it's raging,

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it's kind of a slow, patient exit to get back to safety.

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So outdoor recreation as a career now that's it's interesting because it seems

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to be a much more i guess i'll say a viable career in in ireland and the uk,

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than it is here in the u.s so tell me about that.

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Yeah, we could spend a whole week speaking about that particular topic.

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But yeah, look, I started out

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in this because I didn't really know I wanted to do when I left school.

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I just happened upon it. But over my career, it has evolved into quite a defined

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sector and it is pretty well resourced.

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There are things that we'd like to improve, but it's a very powerful learning

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tool, not just for the young, for people of all ages and classes.

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And I'm deeply passionate about sharing what I've learned from the power of

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outdoor education with others.

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It isn't always about the winner or the first to the top of the mountain.

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It's about just being in nature and I suppose the well-being or the presence

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that it can bring. I'm really interested in that and how people operate outdoors.

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So tell us about your experience with the outdoor centers.

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I suppose we always look back on our youth somewhat with rose-tinted glasses.

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But I spoke there previously about my few years with the Cap'n Lee and that

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was, it really was an amazing time. There was such energy about,

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we had a vision for the centre and how we wanted to teach.

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People were dedicated to their job and they pushed hard, passionately to do

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their best by their students. So that kind of gave me an early benchmark of

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how things should be or could be.

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And after I left there, I wanted to get into more responsibility.

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So I took a job as an activity manager up in Killary Adventure Centre on the west coast of Ireland.

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And slowly but surely, I started to work my way through the ranks and...

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I had other jobs, like I was a development officer for our national governing

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body here with Canoeing Ireland for a few years.

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And then I ran my own outdoor business for 13 years. So I set up H2OC kayaking.

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I had a G-Town surf school. And so I've had so many experiences.

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But as I kind of came into 2011-12, I was kind of looking for something more.

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And there wasn't much security in the kind of business I had at the time.

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We'd been through some up and down times with the recession.

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So I went back to college and studied outdoor education in a well-known institute here.

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And that sort of set me up to move into the public sector where I was really

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fortunate to come and work for Cork Education and Training Board.

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And I now managed two of our state-funded outdoor centers for them.

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For those who are not in Ireland or in the UK, either of the two,

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I suppose, tell us a little bit about how the outdoor, sorry,

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how the adventure center model works. That's not something that's common here in the US.

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Yes, and this is one of the curious things about outdoor education.

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If you travel around the world, there are various models of provision.

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So I suppose the foundation of outdoor education could be traced back to,

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say, the scouting movement or the emergence of camping in the UK as a kind of

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a holiday concept in the 1920s and 30s.

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But outdoor education centers, their roots here in Ireland go back to the late 60s and early 70s.

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So we kind of have two models of provision here in Ireland. We have 12 state

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funded outdoor education centers, and then we have a whole network of fantastic

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commercial or private outdoor centers.

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So it does mean that our society here have pretty good access to a range of

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activities and programs across age groups and social classes and so on.

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So what activities might one find at an outdoor center? So our two centers in

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Kinsalen and Scull here in Cork, they're primarily known for sailing, but sea kayaking.

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We do a lot of powerboat training.

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We do rock climbing, orienteering. And more recently, we've really begun to

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focus on camp craft skills and environmental outdoor education.

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And I suppose educating the upcoming generations that all these opportunities

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are here for you. we need to look after them.

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And also, if you spend time in them, you can also enhance your mental health

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and, you know, get better at making decisions and all the typical benefits that

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one expects from spending time outdoors.

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So tell us, how do you see the sport of sea kayaking advancing over the years?

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Or how have you seen it advancing over the years?

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Yeah. And this is something that really intrigues me a lot.

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I would be really excited about where sea kayaking is in terms of innovation.

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You know, there are national governing bodies all over the world.

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They all have schemes that allow people to come into the sport and to be trained

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well and to ultimately stay safer out in their activity, but also to extract,

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you know, a lot of fun and learning for themselves.

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So there's been a lot of advances in that space in recent years,

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I sometimes am a little bit concerned about maybe the over-focus on maybe people

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wanting to get the best bit of video for YouTube or who paddled in the biggest seas.

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And so that sometimes worries me that people are competitive by nature to seek that footage.

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And sometimes there seems to be a lot of emphasis on how to climb back into your boat.

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Well, maybe if they spent more time focusing on staying in the boat for starters.

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And I mean that Humorously, but I really am interested in where we're going.

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I mean, with the advent of the likes of online sea kayaking,

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it's a really innovative space that Simon and James have developed there.

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But there are also so many exciting providers, not just in Ireland and the UK,

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but all over the world, where if somebody's ambitious and they want to go to a specialist in,

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Greenland rolling or expeditioning or the first aid side of things,

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there are multiple providers to choose from.

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So I see us as a very strong community. But I have one aim that I would hope

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to try and advance in the coming years is I do think we can do more to look

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out for our coastlines and to make sea kayaking as environmentally friendly as we possibly can.

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And unfortunately, we use a lot of materials in the makeup of our equipment

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that sometimes doesn't match with the sustainability side of things.

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Watch this space, John. Are there other ideas that you have to help with that?

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Yeah, I've never been a big fan of, you know, trying to enforce rules and that.

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I think it's really good if people are consulted and asked, how would you like

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to do this? What's the best way to do it?

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But definitely some sort of easygoing code of conduct that we can self-enforce would be good.

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I mean, there are so many initiatives like Surfers Against Sewage were the kind

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of first ones to do it, but the Clean Seas group.

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So if everybody did their little bit along the way

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in reflecting on how they use their camping practices, maybe ethical choices

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around sourcing their equipment, we could make sea kayaking an even more responsible

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place and play our small part in what is a climate emergency.

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So what do you think are the barriers that are preventing people from thinking that way?

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I sometimes think that our sport can be a little clannish but that's no different

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to mountaineering or any other adventure activity for that matter

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so i guess one thing that binds us all together is the sea and i mean it's well

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documented internationally that some groups and industries use the sea as a dumping ground,

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we use it for our enjoyment and well-being and and for adventure,

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so if if sea kayakers could have a common space to agree that yeah we really

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need to look out for it i think that would help us an awful lot but there are

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lots of really good silos of activity like that happening

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but i would like to see some form of informal code that would bind us together

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and and look after our space more,

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and from a teaching standpoint how do you see teaching advancing and changing over the years that's a.

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One thing that would concern me slightly is sometimes if you ask a kayaker,

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well, what experience do you have?

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Well, they might say I've got level this cert or level that cert.

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And even though I'm involved in sea kayaking education and I train and assess

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people, I do think it's important to just step away from that.

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It is fantastic to get proper training and to be safe and to plan well.

00:15:43.133 --> 00:15:47.703
But the true essence of the sport is about expeditioning and journeying and

00:15:47.703 --> 00:15:51.010
sometimes pitting oneself against nature and the sea,

00:15:51.521 --> 00:15:56.753
so not to lose sight of that, so I really, I'm a big advocate for putting the

00:15:56.753 --> 00:16:01.685
tent in the boat, planning well, and going into uncertainty to see what happens.

00:16:02.051 --> 00:16:07.984
So you and Sean Cahill did an Around Ireland journey in 2015.

00:16:08.604 --> 00:16:12.189
And you did a brilliant documentary. It was just a fantastic,

00:16:12.189 --> 00:16:15.469
fantastic watch. And I will make sure I put that in the show notes here for

00:16:15.469 --> 00:16:17.267
folks to check out as well.

00:16:17.697 --> 00:16:21.829
But you had a message in there and it kind of spoke to what you just mentioned.

00:16:21.829 --> 00:16:24.835
So tell us a little bit about that message you had for the everyday paddler.

00:16:25.311 --> 00:16:28.989
Well first of all thank you for your kind words about the documentary it's it's

00:16:28.989 --> 00:16:30.659
like the gift that keeps on giving,

00:16:31.119 --> 00:16:34.539
you know we made it with love for the sport of sea kike and we gave it out for

00:16:34.539 --> 00:16:40.443
free we never sought fame or fortune or or money out of it so it's achieved that,

00:16:40.896 --> 00:16:46.319
tenfold for us but i guess the reason that we did that was both of us were introduced

00:16:46.319 --> 00:16:51.484
to the sport by amazing people and if it wasn't for them we wouldn't be where we are now,

00:16:51.960 --> 00:16:54.015
i guess we were just kind of saying to people that,

00:16:54.572 --> 00:16:56.911
you might have a dream in your head about sea kayaking.

00:16:57.057 --> 00:17:00.394
It may not necessarily be about paddling around Ireland, any adventure,

00:17:00.720 --> 00:17:04.829
but make that dream a goal and sit down and get a poster or sit down with a

00:17:04.829 --> 00:17:07.987
friend and map it out, make a list, make a plan.

00:17:08.324 --> 00:17:11.848
I'm a really big believer in training dirty to battle easy.

00:17:12.208 --> 00:17:15.429
In fact, I had a really interesting conversation with Jeff Allen once about

00:17:15.847 --> 00:17:18.866
what's the best way to train for an expedition and get fit.

00:17:19.435 --> 00:17:22.569
I think he was quite right in saying and just get get in the sea as much as

00:17:22.569 --> 00:17:27.718
you can get beaten up by the sea a bit sea swimming would be a great way of doing it so um,

00:17:28.258 --> 00:17:32.749
i guess i love the uncertainty of that but my advice to people is just plan

00:17:32.749 --> 00:17:37.359
in detail contrary to what people might think on my training for around ireland,

00:17:37.910 --> 00:17:43.083
i actually didn't do as much long distance paddling as you might assume but i did a lot of dirty.

00:17:43.657 --> 00:17:49.613
Dirty sea kayaking i did thousands of rolls lots of surf kayaking and just getting my confidence.

00:17:50.792 --> 00:17:51.489
Levels high.

00:17:51.489 --> 00:17:54.949
So the first day we went around Ireland, without being arrogant about it,

00:17:54.949 --> 00:17:57.206
I kind of had a feeling, yeah, I'm going to be okay here.

00:17:57.650 --> 00:18:01.089
What might you recommend for the average everyday paddler to prepare for something

00:18:01.089 --> 00:18:04.517
like a round Ireland expedition or something large in general?

00:18:05.132 --> 00:18:08.714
Start small, you know, build yourself up incrementally. You know,

00:18:08.714 --> 00:18:10.674
there's so many factors to think about.

00:18:11.214 --> 00:18:14.904
You really have to think about all the dynamics of the sea, the wind,

00:18:14.904 --> 00:18:18.294
the weather, the tides, the influence they have on the coastline,

00:18:18.294 --> 00:18:22.314
localised effects, and you need to get comfortable in those conditions.

00:18:22.314 --> 00:18:25.177
Your equipment set up as well has to be well tested.

00:18:25.732 --> 00:18:29.804
If you go on long trips like that, you've got to be prepared for being cold,

00:18:29.804 --> 00:18:34.744
wet, hungry, tired, and needing to draw on your resilience. And whilst it might

00:18:34.744 --> 00:18:36.191
not be pleasant at the time.

00:18:36.626 --> 00:18:40.744
If you can see through that and push beyond that uncomfort, when you get back

00:18:40.744 --> 00:18:44.314
off it, then you'll be left with a powerful memory for the rest of your life.

00:18:44.314 --> 00:18:49.162
So yeah, I kind of like those moments where you're in adversity.

00:18:49.702 --> 00:18:52.944
So you mentioned train dirty to battle clearly or cleanly, excuse me.

00:18:52.944 --> 00:18:55.449
To battle hard, yeah. Battle hard. Okay. All right.

00:18:55.913 --> 00:18:59.439
And you said that's kind of what you focused on for your skill building.

00:18:59.875 --> 00:19:04.879
As a paddle sports instructor, how do you employ that in your instruction?

00:19:06.602 --> 00:19:09.438
I think some people might say I have a bit of a brand for that.

00:19:09.438 --> 00:19:15.148
So, yeah, look, there's a concept out there of, you know, training in your comfort zone.

00:19:15.148 --> 00:19:18.148
And if you do that, you're probably not going to learn too much.

00:19:18.148 --> 00:19:24.448
So the challenge of my job is to, me paddlers, have a quick assessment of where

00:19:24.448 --> 00:19:27.588
they're at, make a shopping list of what it is they need to work on.

00:19:27.588 --> 00:19:32.428
But to bring them outside their comfort zone to their adventure zone and sometimes

00:19:32.428 --> 00:19:35.098
to bring them right outside to the edge of their adventure zone.

00:19:35.098 --> 00:19:38.058
But never crossing over into disaster zones.

00:19:38.418 --> 00:19:42.268
It takes a degree of confidence and courage to do that some days and don't always

00:19:42.268 --> 00:19:46.938
get it right because not only are you looking after somebody's physical well-being

00:19:46.938 --> 00:19:50.098
on the water but also their mental and emotional well-being too.

00:19:50.098 --> 00:19:55.048
So I'm really interested to get that mix right with people and we talk a lot

00:19:55.048 --> 00:19:59.668
beforehand. We're very active out in the water but we also take time out to

00:19:59.668 --> 00:20:04.057
review and evaluate and look at what do we need to do the next time when we go out.

00:20:04.545 --> 00:20:08.518
But yeah, I'm really interested in seeing how people respond to the environment

00:20:08.518 --> 00:20:10.437
and my teaching. All right.

00:20:11.100 --> 00:20:15.059
So back to the, uh, to the Round Island trip or, or any large expedition.

00:20:15.552 --> 00:20:18.830
So use that one as an example. So what skill level or how would you,

00:20:18.830 --> 00:20:21.380
how would a person be able to gauge that they're ready?

00:20:21.677 --> 00:20:24.500
So when you had that moment on that first day and you said, yeah,

00:20:24.500 --> 00:20:27.462
I'm okay with this. What was it that got you to that point?

00:20:28.069 --> 00:20:33.080
Yeah, I'd be big into getting a poster out and, you know, doing a mind map of,

00:20:33.080 --> 00:20:37.360
you know, your goal in the middle and then having bullet bubbles all for all

00:20:37.360 --> 00:20:39.034
the different skill sets that you need.

00:20:39.540 --> 00:20:43.348
Navigating and paddling in fog over long distances, open crossings.

00:20:43.753 --> 00:20:47.000
That's a pretty big one you have to get right for any major expedition.

00:20:47.000 --> 00:20:49.671
Sequencing of gear, testing out the food.

00:20:50.135 --> 00:20:55.630
So it's really, to put it simply, John, it's leave no stone unturned before you set off.

00:20:55.630 --> 00:21:00.850
And if you've built that mental mind map in your head, well,

00:21:00.850 --> 00:21:04.509
it certainly makes things a lot easier. I'd be very cautious about heading off,

00:21:05.030 --> 00:21:07.278
without having that level of preparation.

00:21:07.856 --> 00:21:09.190
So you have some involvement with

00:21:09.190 --> 00:21:14.119
the RNLI as well. Yes, that was a really interesting chapter in my life.

00:21:14.351 --> 00:21:20.050
So when I changed jobs in 2017, I'm fortunate enough to work just a couple of

00:21:20.050 --> 00:21:22.304
hundred meters from our local RNLI station.

00:21:22.751 --> 00:21:26.810
And it'll always been a goal of mine to give something back to the sea for something

00:21:26.810 --> 00:21:28.473
that's been so kind to me over the years.

00:21:29.233 --> 00:21:33.587
I think it's well documented on previous podcasts here. You've had some amazing Ornalloy people on.

00:21:34.086 --> 00:21:38.109
And it is a really unique service where it's entirely voluntary.

00:21:38.423 --> 00:21:42.480
There's very little ego, if none at all, involved in it. And the people that

00:21:42.480 --> 00:21:48.430
crew those boats come there selflessly. So I had five amazing years of service

00:21:48.430 --> 00:21:52.471
with them. And unfortunately, due to health reasons, I had to retire from the boat crew last year.

00:21:52.808 --> 00:21:55.980
I was probably one of the youngest crew members ever to get a hip replacement.

00:21:55.980 --> 00:22:02.987
So, but yeah, during the five years, I came across some pretty interesting stuff at sea.

00:22:03.353 --> 00:22:07.570
I think one of the things I enjoyed most was the camaraderie of heading off

00:22:07.570 --> 00:22:14.820
on a shout with three other expert crew members by my side and just seeing what are we going to?

00:22:15.280 --> 00:22:19.470
What do we need to do? And hopefully getting a result. And many of those would

00:22:19.470 --> 00:22:23.091
be very successful results. And then sometimes there are some sad moments when,

00:22:23.521 --> 00:22:26.783
unfortunately, we have to pick up people that have sadly passed.

00:22:27.323 --> 00:22:30.429
So you recently paddled the Cork Coastline.

00:22:31.300 --> 00:22:34.350
Tell us about that trip and why it was important to you. Well,

00:22:34.350 --> 00:22:36.200
I was always curious about solo.

00:22:37.300 --> 00:22:40.608
I've done lots of solo paddling, but always kind of day trips and so on.

00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:45.280
And that's a bit of a dilemma for me as well, because as someone who teaches

00:22:45.280 --> 00:22:49.140
sea kayaking professionally, you know within those systems that we teach solo

00:22:49.140 --> 00:22:54.120
paddling isn't really encouraged and it can be somewhat of a divisive issue

00:22:54.120 --> 00:22:55.820
for people but how and ever,

00:22:56.438 --> 00:22:58.880
what I paddle in my own time is a separate thing John.

00:22:59.680 --> 00:23:03.610
But to answer your question I suppose first of all I made a commitment my wife

00:23:03.610 --> 00:23:07.524
had been unwell for a period of time and thankfully she's fine now but,

00:23:08.290 --> 00:23:12.691
After that sort of time, I had to get back out there and do something for myself.

00:23:13.138 --> 00:23:16.801
So I was always curious about my core coastline that I live on here.

00:23:16.801 --> 00:23:20.573
And it's an amazing county and a superb coastline.

00:23:21.060 --> 00:23:26.169
So really, I just wanted to attack it alpine style and see how fast I could go.

00:23:26.748 --> 00:23:30.861
And now that I have it done, I'm looking at it and go, OK, I need to go and

00:23:30.861 --> 00:23:33.865
do it again because I know I can shave a lot more time off it. But yeah.

00:23:34.568 --> 00:23:41.616
What I really enjoyed was the solitary time, the peace, the quiet I had.

00:23:41.952 --> 00:23:47.490
An orca whale jumped up in front of me near Darcy Sound coming through the Mizzen

00:23:47.833 --> 00:23:49.559
Tide Race. It was enormous.

00:23:49.899 --> 00:23:54.099
I had to brace many times through that Tide Race. And when I got through it,

00:23:54.479 --> 00:23:58.589
I felt like I'd just won the World Cup. It was just a really brilliant four

00:23:58.589 --> 00:24:02.399
and a half days at sea and met some nice people along the way,

00:24:02.399 --> 00:24:04.192
as you always do on the Irish coastline.

00:24:04.679 --> 00:24:09.887
And also, I'm a big fan of falcon sails. You may know Patrick Forrester there.

00:24:10.659 --> 00:24:15.747
He's built some amazing kit. And I used that sail for some of that trip, not all of it.

00:24:16.066 --> 00:24:18.824
But I'm curious to go and do more solo paddling with a sail.

00:24:19.248 --> 00:24:24.059
So how was this trip, the Cork Coastline, different from your round Ireland

00:24:24.059 --> 00:24:25.778
trip? What was the different experience?

00:24:26.391 --> 00:24:28.919
Well, I guess I didn't have my sidekick with me, Sean Cahill.

00:24:28.919 --> 00:24:32.829
And, you know, for anybody that's watched the documentary, I guess you'll have

00:24:32.829 --> 00:24:34.758
a sense that we're really close.

00:24:35.048 --> 00:24:38.159
We meet up several times every year and we do a lot together.

00:24:38.159 --> 00:24:42.821
We know how each other ticks. So it did feel a bit bizarre being on a trip without him.

00:24:43.425 --> 00:24:46.659
But I have a very busy life, as many people do.

00:24:47.039 --> 00:24:50.757
I spend an awful lot of time on my phone on laptops admitting other people's,

00:24:51.239 --> 00:24:54.994
adventures. So it was a great disconnection from tech.

00:24:55.395 --> 00:24:59.749
In fact, I spent very little time texting or talking to other people on that trip.

00:24:59.749 --> 00:25:05.469
And I was singing aloud at sea, just enjoying nice sunrises and sunsets.

00:25:05.469 --> 00:25:10.519
And yeah, it's kind of hard to describe, John. It was just, it was so immersive.

00:25:10.902 --> 00:25:15.597
So did you see something different in the coast that you didn't see on that first trip?

00:25:16.230 --> 00:25:20.939
Yes, there was one very special day. It was the second day of the trip.

00:25:20.939 --> 00:25:27.689
And I had nervousness about doing the Miz and crossing. It's 27 kilometers from one side to the other.

00:25:28.217 --> 00:25:32.119
And the last time I'd done that crossing, it took us nearly nine hours and I'd

00:25:32.119 --> 00:25:35.392
actually didn't think we were going to make it because we had to do it in quite strong winds.

00:25:36.442 --> 00:25:40.238
But on that day, when I was on my own on the core coastline trip,

00:25:40.747 --> 00:25:44.923
I had said to my wife earlier by text, I don't think I'll do it today.

00:25:44.923 --> 00:25:48.392
I think I might just take a roundabout route and go via Sheepshead.

00:25:49.012 --> 00:25:53.673
But something was calling me as I came to it. And when I came through a gap

00:25:53.673 --> 00:25:59.463
near Crowhead, I just saw the very faint outline of Mizzen across the bay.

00:25:59.463 --> 00:26:05.053
And I just turned my kayak right and went for it. And it was such a liberating

00:26:05.053 --> 00:26:08.679
three hours. And I think I did the whole crossing in three and a half hours or so.

00:26:09.213 --> 00:26:12.908
And then to finish it off by coming through a massive tide race on my own.

00:26:13.105 --> 00:26:16.867
Yeah, it was probably one of the most powerful solo moments I've had in a sea kite.

00:26:17.163 --> 00:26:19.953
So just a very empowering trip. Yeah.

00:26:20.353 --> 00:26:24.443
I think if people are listening well here, they'll probably gauge that that

00:26:24.443 --> 00:26:27.983
might determine the next chapters of my sea kayaking career. All right.

00:26:28.210 --> 00:26:33.144
Well, I may ask and we'll see if you'll spill anything on that one.

00:26:33.833 --> 00:26:38.973
So solo you mentioned solo and in controversy sometimes so let's let's kind

00:26:38.973 --> 00:26:42.769
of unpack that a little bit what do you see as the controversies and how to overcome that.

00:26:44.104 --> 00:26:48.693
Well okay one doesn't have to look too far there unfortunately are several sea

00:26:48.693 --> 00:26:51.453
kayaking accidents every year and yeah i think

00:26:51.893 --> 00:26:55.233
we all set out you know we have responsibilities to come home to our loved ones

00:26:55.233 --> 00:26:59.344
and so on and nobody intentionally sets out to to come to harm's way

00:26:59.762 --> 00:27:03.743
but we do have a responsibility to plan our trips well and to train ourselves

00:27:03.743 --> 00:27:07.551
properly, either with a provider or through our clubs and so on.

00:27:08.120 --> 00:27:13.073
So the decision to go solo, it's a personal choice. I'm not really into saying

00:27:13.073 --> 00:27:15.254
to people, you can't do that or you shouldn't do that.

00:27:15.643 --> 00:27:19.080
People should be equipped with the correct decision making themselves.

00:27:19.405 --> 00:27:23.730
It's happened all through time. One only has to look at the Inuit culture and,

00:27:24.235 --> 00:27:26.754
even that famous book, The Story of Finmen.

00:27:26.882 --> 00:27:33.395
So it does happen, but be careful how you go about it, would be my advice to anyone. All right.

00:27:34.072 --> 00:27:38.676
So that Cork trip, that sounds like it was just a really fantastic experience

00:27:38.676 --> 00:27:42.537
for you. What are some of your other favorite places to paddle in Ireland?

00:27:43.158 --> 00:27:46.446
So the Fastenet Rock, I really would encourage any of your listeners,

00:27:46.446 --> 00:27:51.756
if you're not familiar with it, go to Google after this podcast and Google the Fastenet Rock.

00:27:51.756 --> 00:27:56.316
So I have a little story for you here that might help people understand my fascination

00:27:56.316 --> 00:28:00.206
with this. So when I was a child, as I said, my parents used to bring me on

00:28:00.206 --> 00:28:01.908
holidays to Scal in West Cork.

00:28:02.460 --> 00:28:07.246
And where we used to stay in my bedroom every six seconds my bedroom would light

00:28:07.246 --> 00:28:11.776
up at night from the Fastnet Rock which was about 12 miles away from that,

00:28:12.229 --> 00:28:16.866
so that was kind of burnt into my childhood memories but I went to the Fastnet

00:28:16.866 --> 00:28:22.856
Rock in 1996 with my friend Donald Dowd it was an amazing experience to go from

00:28:22.856 --> 00:28:24.808
childhood to actually being there

00:28:25.185 --> 00:28:27.216
and since then I've made at my business

00:28:27.216 --> 00:28:31.006
to go out there every season and sometimes several times a season.

00:28:31.366 --> 00:28:34.776
We don't always get to land, but I've landed many times. Last summer,

00:28:34.776 --> 00:28:38.577
we had pretty amazing weather here in Ireland on two high pressures.

00:28:38.954 --> 00:28:43.366
And so I got to land in it again. And I just felt at this point in life,

00:28:43.686 --> 00:28:47.876
I want to make a commitment to the Fastenet Rock. So I actually have a pretty

00:28:47.876 --> 00:28:51.226
nice tattoo of the Fastenet Lighthouse on my leg that I'm really proud of.

00:28:52.494 --> 00:28:56.686
But I have still other islands I've got Bull Rock, which was amazing.

00:28:56.686 --> 00:28:58.578
Check that one out. The Skelligs.

00:28:59.170 --> 00:29:03.216
We had a superb trip to the Skelligs last summer. People will be familiar from

00:29:03.216 --> 00:29:07.846
that, with the Star Wars movies. But then we've also got the Blaskets,

00:29:07.846 --> 00:29:09.832
the Salties, the Inish Gies. So, you know,

00:29:10.509 --> 00:29:12.005
We have a beautiful book here as

00:29:12.005 --> 00:29:16.586
well that I think Kevin mentioned on his podcast with you, the Ilan book.

00:29:16.998 --> 00:29:20.505
So if somebody is interested in coming to Ireland, that's always a good start point.

00:29:20.819 --> 00:29:25.294
Order that book and start taking the highlights or to the ones you want to tick off.

00:29:26.285 --> 00:29:30.925
As a self-professed map nerd and one who just reads guidebooks for fun,

00:29:31.265 --> 00:29:34.345
that Ilan is fantastic. Yeah, yeah.

00:29:34.865 --> 00:29:38.785
It is a great read, very enjoyable. Thank you, yeah.

00:29:40.097 --> 00:29:44.835
And I suppose the other thing then is I got into kite surfing five years ago.

00:29:44.835 --> 00:29:47.028
I've always had a fascination with surf sports.

00:29:47.905 --> 00:29:52.395
As I said, I owned a surf school for many years. And again, I had some naivety.

00:29:52.395 --> 00:29:56.175
I had a good friend of mine, Tommy, and he got into kite surfing before me.

00:29:56.185 --> 00:29:59.560
And he said, you're missing a trick here, John. You got to come try this.

00:30:00.001 --> 00:30:03.375
And I guess foolishly, I didn't want to be a beginner all over again and go

00:30:03.375 --> 00:30:05.615
through all the school of hard knocks.

00:30:05.615 --> 00:30:10.225
But I finally relented and got into that. And it's, I guess,

00:30:10.225 --> 00:30:14.955
on the days where it's too windy to go sea kayaking here, we just go kite surfing

00:30:14.955 --> 00:30:18.229
now. And it's just another way of connecting with the sea.

00:30:18.449 --> 00:30:20.825
Even though there's a bit of tech involved in it with the gear,

00:30:20.825 --> 00:30:26.775
it's one of the purest ways of harnessing wind and surf. And that's led to many

00:30:26.775 --> 00:30:28.550
amazing adventures around here as well.

00:30:28.776 --> 00:30:32.105
So tell us a little bit about kite surfing. I'm seeing more and more of that.

00:30:32.665 --> 00:30:35.705
Let's go into that a little bit more. Well, people think that it's a really

00:30:35.705 --> 00:30:38.685
hard sport to learn. Some people have varied experiences.

00:30:39.145 --> 00:30:42.865
Some people crack it within a month, the basics, and others take six months,

00:30:42.865 --> 00:30:44.682
and others walk away in frustration.

00:30:45.727 --> 00:30:48.533
We're very proud of our coastline here in Ireland. You know,

00:30:48.533 --> 00:30:53.604
we're on the edge of Europe, the west coast of Ireland, the wild Atlantic way as it's known.

00:30:54.034 --> 00:30:55.989
It's known for its raw beauty.

00:30:56.506 --> 00:31:00.053
You know, we just get these bowling ball low pressures coming across from the

00:31:00.053 --> 00:31:02.721
Caribbean and that light up our coastline quite a lot.

00:31:03.099 --> 00:31:06.223
So there are days when it's too rough to go sea kayaking, as I say.

00:31:06.223 --> 00:31:11.463
So, yeah, it's just one of those coastlines that lends itself really well to sea kayaking.

00:31:11.463 --> 00:31:14.713
And it kind of changed my view of Irish winters as well.

00:31:14.713 --> 00:31:20.233
I used to view them as cold, dark, miserable times, but it actually shifted that view.

00:31:20.233 --> 00:31:24.633
And I actually can't wait for winter to come when the seas get big and it gets

00:31:24.633 --> 00:31:28.993
pretty wild out there. So kitesurfing is, it can be a pretty,

00:31:29.893 --> 00:31:31.113
I know people might laugh at this.

00:31:31.513 --> 00:31:35.694
I find it quite a spiritual experience because there's so much speed in it,

00:31:36.043 --> 00:31:39.688
a lot of adrenaline. But when you get a chance to go on a wave,

00:31:39.851 --> 00:31:43.606
it is like a canvas and it's up to you to draw whatever you want on that wave.

00:31:44.059 --> 00:31:47.673
I like the fact that it doesn't use any petrol or, you know,

00:31:48.153 --> 00:31:53.313
it's such a quiet sport in some ways as well. And even though I'm 50 now this

00:31:53.313 --> 00:31:55.913
year, I can still feel like I'm 25 again.

00:31:58.054 --> 00:32:03.824
Always a good feeling. Yeah, yeah. So what message do you have for paddlers in general?

00:32:04.478 --> 00:32:08.071
A little bit like what I said to you earlier on, you know, be ambitious.

00:32:08.605 --> 00:32:12.402
There's so much that impacts on our lives these days.

00:32:12.657 --> 00:32:18.463
Technology social media the i suppose climate anxiety would be another one that's

00:32:18.463 --> 00:32:23.073
really impacting young people these days so being in nature through sea kayaking

00:32:23.073 --> 00:32:25.632
is one of those ways that you can enhance your life,

00:32:26.142 --> 00:32:30.159
and it isn't always about the level five certificate or.

00:32:30.962 --> 00:32:35.271
You know, who'd paddle the biggest wave. It's the sense of community that you

00:32:35.271 --> 00:32:37.771
can feel in a kayak club or a paddling group.

00:32:38.345 --> 00:32:44.963
That early morning sunrise, glassy oily seas, seeing a dolphin rise beside you,

00:32:45.504 --> 00:32:48.592
moments around a campfire with friends trading stories.

00:32:49.057 --> 00:32:53.461
I'm just really interested in the well-being aspect that sea kayaking can bring

00:32:53.861 --> 00:32:55.116
to groups and communities.

00:32:55.406 --> 00:33:01.321
Do you think that that movement is coming back i do yeah like the successes

00:33:01.321 --> 00:33:03.135
in mountaineering i'm kind of.

00:33:03.747 --> 00:33:06.971
They're they're pretty much all done now at this stage and and now it's just

00:33:06.971 --> 00:33:13.029
who can do it faster but i still think there are boundaries to be explored in sea kayaking so,

00:33:13.517 --> 00:33:16.991
when the guys paddled from greenland back to scotland i mean that that was just

00:33:16.991 --> 00:33:22.331
an amazing breakthrough boundary and i'm curious to see what people will do

00:33:22.331 --> 00:33:27.199
next and look at alexander doba and his three trips across the Atlantic.

00:33:27.698 --> 00:33:32.051
There's so many amazing opportunities that can yet be done. What do you see

00:33:32.051 --> 00:33:34.420
as the great undone challenge?

00:33:34.920 --> 00:33:39.701
Well, I would imagine the Pacific is probably one. I mean, I think there is

00:33:39.701 --> 00:33:42.350
a lady rowing across the Pacific at the moment solo.

00:33:42.876 --> 00:33:46.997
She's probably, I don't know, a thousand miles east of Australia.

00:33:47.264 --> 00:33:50.931
So yeah, I think that's probably one. I mean, the Atlantic's been done several

00:33:50.931 --> 00:33:53.504
times now between Pete Bray and Alexander Doba.

00:33:53.933 --> 00:33:57.991
But obviously the big circumnavs are all there and you know freya has done some

00:33:57.991 --> 00:34:03.421
amazing things for the sport and then clearly as climate change happens as well

00:34:03.421 --> 00:34:07.923
that's going to change the poles and the seascapes and the ice caps there so.

00:34:08.881 --> 00:34:13.438
I really don't know and that's part of the joy of adventure is the uncertainty,

00:34:14.301 --> 00:34:18.699
yeah i've had many guests we've talked about taking the adventure out of the adventure,

00:34:19.581 --> 00:34:25.131
and sometimes programming it so much that I forget to see what's around me and

00:34:25.131 --> 00:34:26.436
I forget to really experience it.

00:34:27.277 --> 00:34:31.270
I think that's a really good point. I speak about that sometimes with the instructors

00:34:31.270 --> 00:34:35.780
that work with me, that it is important to plan the activities and cover off,

00:34:35.780 --> 00:34:40.156
you know, some of the uncertainties, but let's not over sterilize it as well.

00:34:40.474 --> 00:34:45.270
People need to get mucky and wet and cold the odd time and experience a bit

00:34:45.270 --> 00:34:49.040
of hunger. And that way, when they get back to the campfire and get a nice warm

00:34:49.040 --> 00:34:52.410
sleeping bag, they appreciate the experience they've gone through that day.

00:34:52.790 --> 00:34:57.249
And sometimes that's where the best learning comes from. You said it. it.

00:34:58.307 --> 00:35:02.331
Roaring water. Tell us about roaring water. Yeah, I'd love to be able to wave

00:35:02.331 --> 00:35:06.031
a magic wand. And if there's listeners there around the world right now that

00:35:06.031 --> 00:35:09.676
are curious about that, it's an amazing place to see kayaking.

00:35:10.070 --> 00:35:13.837
I suppose in some ways you could relate it a little bit like the west coast of Scotland.

00:35:14.133 --> 00:35:21.010
It does have some strong tidal flows, but a myriad of islands and no two days are the same.

00:35:21.399 --> 00:35:24.035
There's some amazing history there around the islands.

00:35:24.430 --> 00:35:29.004
People still speak Irish out in Cape Clear. There's stories of piracy.

00:35:29.248 --> 00:35:32.521
And obviously, you know, Ireland has a very colourful history and,

00:35:32.521 --> 00:35:34.873
you know, some tough times around the famine and so on.

00:35:35.326 --> 00:35:38.750
So it's a way you can sort of transport yourself back in time.

00:35:39.302 --> 00:35:43.961
And I guess the thing I like about it most is that no two days are the same

00:35:43.961 --> 00:35:48.332
and I never take a day out there for granted. So where is this area?

00:35:49.253 --> 00:35:53.223
So it's right down the southwest tip of Ireland. So it would be near Mizzenhead,

00:35:53.623 --> 00:35:55.691
which is our most southwesterly point.

00:35:55.691 --> 00:36:01.141
It's pretty easy to get to you can fly into cork airport there are local providers there,

00:36:01.621 --> 00:36:05.641
you know our friends jim kennedy from atlantic sea kayaking or we can help you

00:36:05.641 --> 00:36:07.231
out with our outdoor center and,

00:36:07.689 --> 00:36:11.281
also give a great shout out to the local west cork kayak club down there who

00:36:11.281 --> 00:36:15.131
do an awful lot of great work to keep people out in the water and enjoying the

00:36:15.131 --> 00:36:19.831
sport of paddling a couple things you mentioned earlier one singing you said

00:36:19.831 --> 00:36:22.080
you were singing along the way what do you sing,

00:36:23.221 --> 00:36:26.654
well don't ask me to sing in your podcast or your ratings will drop.

00:36:28.210 --> 00:36:33.109
Yeah, music is a big passion of mine. What do I sing?

00:36:33.469 --> 00:36:37.441
Well, I'm a big fan of the Cranberries, an Irish band from Limerick where I grew up.

00:36:38.777 --> 00:36:43.997
I don't know. Over the last few years, I wouldn't be a particularly religious

00:36:43.997 --> 00:36:45.767
person, but I would be spiritual.

00:36:45.767 --> 00:36:49.867
So I have enjoyed a lot writing about my adventures.

00:36:49.867 --> 00:36:53.227
And that's something that I've been trying to perfect and hone.

00:36:53.227 --> 00:36:58.190
And I just recently signed up to a master's in outdoor education,

00:36:58.521 --> 00:37:00.067
sustainability and well-being.

00:37:00.067 --> 00:37:03.887
And whatever about the academic journey, that's one of the things that I'm enjoying

00:37:03.887 --> 00:37:07.897
a lot is the, you know, the craft of writing about adventure.

00:37:07.897 --> 00:37:12.487
And hopefully I can produce something that might be along the lines of the video

00:37:12.487 --> 00:37:16.219
that people might someday pick up and find interesting.

00:37:16.602 --> 00:37:21.309
And you also mentioned your laptop and phone and all these sorts of things.

00:37:21.663 --> 00:37:27.631
So do you mean to tell us that the life of an outdoor educator is not all outdoor?

00:37:30.537 --> 00:37:35.827
Well, fortunately or unfortunately, my job is to manage two busy outdoor centers.

00:37:35.827 --> 00:37:41.067
And when we're at the height of our season, we had 14 or 15 instructors working

00:37:41.067 --> 00:37:44.537
in each of them last season. I'm surrounded by amazing people at work every

00:37:44.537 --> 00:37:46.617
day who are experts in their field.

00:37:48.143 --> 00:37:50.813
My job is to make sure that the bookings come through for them,

00:37:50.813 --> 00:37:55.523
that they've got the correct resources and logistics to bring large numbers

00:37:55.523 --> 00:37:57.683
of people out into all these activities that we do.

00:37:57.683 --> 00:38:02.013
And the ultimate bit then is that I'm responsible for their health and safety every day.

00:38:02.013 --> 00:38:07.443
So I try to seek a healthy balance between the admin work. And I guess I am

00:38:07.443 --> 00:38:13.186
fortunate I get to cherry pick the sea kayaking courses I'd like to teach. And that keeps me fresh.

00:38:13.651 --> 00:38:18.023
Each year then, one of my goals is I never stand still. Every year,

00:38:18.023 --> 00:38:22.393
I'll always take on a new training course or assessment and qualification to

00:38:22.393 --> 00:38:23.954
keep myself fresh and relevant.

00:38:24.320 --> 00:38:29.621
So when you go on an expedition, what are your, let's say, three must-have pieces of kit?

00:38:30.968 --> 00:38:35.403
I love this question. The Kelly kettle. I'm not sure if all your listeners will

00:38:35.403 --> 00:38:40.573
be familiar with that. Check it out online. But it's a very basic stove for heating water.

00:38:40.643 --> 00:38:46.420
And you can use any dry fuel that your sticks or twigs that you find in the coastline.

00:38:46.775 --> 00:38:51.503
So that's always a really good conversation point because people are curious what's that so,

00:38:52.023 --> 00:38:56.393
we spoke about you know reducing our footprint and and sea hiking around so

00:38:56.393 --> 00:39:01.013
rather than heating water off gas I tried to do it that way now if I'm in a

00:39:01.013 --> 00:39:02.744
hurry I'll bring a gas canister,

00:39:03.267 --> 00:39:06.823
so that would be one piece of kit I'd always bring with me I'm in love with

00:39:06.823 --> 00:39:12.283
my epic carbon wings they just feel like an extension of the body so that that

00:39:12.283 --> 00:39:14.863
has to go everywhere with me and,

00:39:15.393 --> 00:39:17.170
my sleeping bag like in my Therm-a-Rest.

00:39:17.321 --> 00:39:20.664
We're very proud of Therm-a-Rest here in Ireland. They're made here in Cork.

00:39:21.018 --> 00:39:24.573
It's a brand that I've had a long association with. So yeah,

00:39:24.573 --> 00:39:25.663
that goes nowhere without me.

00:39:25.983 --> 00:39:33.018
All right. All right. And then one novelty or luxury item that you must have. Whew.

00:39:34.079 --> 00:39:40.175
Yeah, I have a pretty natty pair of Polartec leggings that my wife wants me to get rid of.

00:39:42.682 --> 00:39:48.493
They're not too kind to look at, but they're toasty when you get off a cold day on the sea.

00:39:48.922 --> 00:39:51.227
All right. So what's next for you?

00:39:51.918 --> 00:39:55.993
Yeah, well, as I mentioned, I'm always curious around learning.

00:39:56.434 --> 00:40:00.788
Yeah, this master's program that I'm engaged in now with the Atlantic Technological

00:40:00.788 --> 00:40:04.188
University, I've been waiting for this program to come around for a while.

00:40:04.188 --> 00:40:06.158
There's some really interesting people on it.

00:40:06.741 --> 00:40:10.048
So it's not that I'm going to stop sea kayaking while I'm doing that.

00:40:10.048 --> 00:40:14.479
Of course, I'm going to keep paddling. And I do have big plans for that space.

00:40:14.978 --> 00:40:18.496
I'm at a point in life now where I'm aware that I am aging.

00:40:18.815 --> 00:40:23.338
I still feel amazingly young, but I want to do something more for the sport.

00:40:23.338 --> 00:40:26.538
You know, as I said, James and Simon are doing something amazing there with

00:40:26.538 --> 00:40:28.388
their online sea kayaking at the moment.

00:40:28.388 --> 00:40:32.849
And I feel I can maybe play my part in the sport to shape the future,

00:40:33.250 --> 00:40:38.898
particularly around our conscientiousness and how we look after the environments we paddle in.

00:40:38.898 --> 00:40:44.478
So that's a chapter that I'm really interested in. And I'm also really fortunate

00:40:44.478 --> 00:40:46.973
that, you know, my wife is into sea kayaking as well.

00:40:47.408 --> 00:40:51.529
And when we go paddling together, it's not about training or assessments or,

00:40:52.133 --> 00:40:53.808
you know, the business of sea kiking.

00:40:53.808 --> 00:40:57.548
It's about something we share passionately together. And thankfully,

00:40:57.548 --> 00:40:59.209
our two daughters, Aoife and Sinead,

00:40:59.552 --> 00:41:03.151
really love being around the sea and surfing and sailing and so on.

00:41:03.761 --> 00:41:06.898
It's, you know, I'm at that time in life where I'm kind of watching that joy

00:41:06.898 --> 00:41:10.799
unfold in them. When you can inspire the next generation, that's a win.

00:41:11.403 --> 00:41:16.594
Perhaps, perhaps, yeah. Thank you. So how can listeners reach you?

00:41:17.137 --> 00:41:20.458
Well, yeah, I've got a bit of a footprint on social media there.

00:41:20.458 --> 00:41:25.513
So if they're on Instagram, just look up Wild Atlantic Warrior and you'll find me there.

00:41:25.965 --> 00:41:29.553
They can email me at johnhines at icloud.com.

00:41:30.023 --> 00:41:32.117
You'll find me at John Hines on Facebook.

00:41:32.674 --> 00:41:37.754
So I'm really fortunate. A lot of paddlers come to Ireland. They find me on the net.

00:41:38.021 --> 00:41:42.558
They reach out a few months beforehand. I'll freely give them help and advice.

00:41:42.558 --> 00:41:47.669
I had some great paddlers over from Brittany last summer and we're going over to meet them and,

00:41:48.358 --> 00:41:52.052
Anybody that's planning around Ireland, you know, just just give us a shout.

00:41:52.052 --> 00:41:56.578
I'm happy to talk and share what I know or where I can help you out.

00:41:56.810 --> 00:41:58.252
Yeah, just just give me a call.

00:41:59.382 --> 00:42:02.242
All right. So I have one final question for you, and that is a question that

00:42:02.242 --> 00:42:05.392
we ask of all of our guests here on the show. And that is, who else would you

00:42:05.392 --> 00:42:07.783
like to hear as a future guest on Paddling the Blue?

00:42:08.253 --> 00:42:11.952
Yes, John, when when I when I heard that we were going to be meeting up and

00:42:11.952 --> 00:42:13.932
recording this, I gave this some

00:42:13.932 --> 00:42:18.292
thought and apologies to anybody that I haven't named here for this one.

00:42:18.292 --> 00:42:21.213
But my number one vote goes to Donald Dowd, and,

00:42:22.111 --> 00:42:26.332
he might not be known throughout the world, but he's a really interesting man

00:42:26.332 --> 00:42:30.762
of the sea, and he's had some amazing principles around the outdoors,

00:42:30.762 --> 00:42:32.502
and not just restricted to sea

00:42:32.502 --> 00:42:36.832
kayaking, he's a passionate orienteer and mountaineer and sailor as well.

00:42:36.832 --> 00:42:41.349
So if you get the chance, I'll give you his contact details and check him out sometime.

00:42:41.575 --> 00:42:45.002
Time. Fantastic. Well, I appreciate that. And I've appreciated the opportunity

00:42:45.002 --> 00:42:49.581
to speak with you and I'll appreciate the opportunity to start to talk with Don O'Dowd as well.

00:42:50.184 --> 00:42:54.252
Yeah. Well, thanks for having me on and keep up the great work with your podcast

00:42:54.252 --> 00:42:58.772
because I've spoken to so many of my students on the courses and they really

00:42:58.772 --> 00:43:02.717
enjoy listening to it. So it adds to our sense of global community.

00:43:02.932 --> 00:43:05.232
That's fantastic. I'm really, really happy to hear that.

00:43:05.632 --> 00:43:09.532
That's the reason that I've done this because it's a fun project for me and

00:43:09.532 --> 00:43:11.359
I'm really glad people get a lot out of it as well.

00:43:11.900 --> 00:43:14.849
Good job. Good job. Thank you. Thank you.

00:43:17.143 --> 00:43:20.714
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00:44:03.392 --> 00:44:06.115
John and I have a lot in common through shared outdoor pursuits.

00:44:06.324 --> 00:44:07.462
Of course, there's paddling.

00:44:07.718 --> 00:44:10.684
But mountain biking and adventure racing are things that I've done quite a bit

00:44:10.684 --> 00:44:13.215
of as well. and John's really into each of those too.

00:44:13.575 --> 00:44:16.007
In fact, I started paddling because of adventure racing.

00:44:16.425 --> 00:44:19.894
Paddling is one of the disciplines and we realized early on that we were pretty

00:44:19.894 --> 00:44:23.604
terrible at it. So we bought boats, made all the mistakes and started improving

00:44:23.604 --> 00:44:27.954
and here we are today. So thanks to John for the opportunity to interview and

00:44:27.954 --> 00:44:30.096
thanks for all the things that you do for the paddle sports world.

00:44:30.531 --> 00:44:34.978
As well, thank you to our partners at OnlineSeaKyaking.com for extending special offers to you.

00:44:35.326 --> 00:44:39.064
Visit OnlineSeaKyaking.com, take advantage of the great programming from James

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and Simon and other talented guests, including previous guests of the Paddling the Blue show.

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Enter the code PTB podcast to check out and get 10% off just for being a member

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of the Paddling the Blue community.

00:44:49.386 --> 00:44:52.554
Until next time, thank you as always for listening and I look forward to bring

00:44:52.554 --> 00:44:55.225
you the next episode of Paddling the Blue.

00:44:57.826 --> 00:45:01.135
Thank you for listening to Paddling the Blue. You can subscribe to Paddling

00:45:01.135 --> 00:45:05.390
the Blue on Apple Music, Spotify, or wherever you find your favorite podcasts.

00:45:05.668 --> 00:45:08.524
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00:45:08.658 --> 00:45:10.347
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00:45:10.684 --> 00:45:13.772
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00:45:13.894 --> 00:45:19.542
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00:45:19.850 --> 00:45:22.880
Until next time, I hope you get out and paddle the blue.