#149 - Sea Kayaking Oman 3165 with Mark Evans

WEBVTT

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Welcome to Paddling the Blue. With each episode, we talk with guests from the

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Great Lakes and around the globe who are doing cool things related to sea kayaking.

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I'm your host, my name is John Chase, and let's get started paddling the blue.

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Welcome to today's episode of the Paddling the Blue podcast.

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I have the pleasure today of talking with Mark Evans.

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Today's episode is a bit backward from our other episodes. Normally,

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we talk with a guest about a trip that has already happened.

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Well, this one hasn't happened yet, and it's about to kick off.

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Mark Evans brings a vast adventure pedigree from crossing Greenland,

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a year in Svalbard, teaching in Africa, and retracing famous routes overland through Africa.

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His latest is a second attempt at paddling the coastline of Amman,

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a country not necessarily known for paddling, but surprisingly rugged by land and rich in water.

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He's got a great story with this, and a great education component with this trip.

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Before we get to today's conversation with Mark, James Stevenson and Simon Osborne

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on OnlineSeaKeyaking.com continue to produce great content to help you evolve

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as a paddler and as a coach.

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You'll find everything from basic strokes and safety to paddling in tides,

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surfing, coaching, documentaries, expedition skills and incident management, and more.

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If you're not already a subscriber to OnlineSeaKeyaking.com,

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here's your opportunity to get started.

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Visit OnlineSeaKeyaking.com, use the coupon code PTBPODCAST to check out,

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and you'll get 10% off just for being a member of the Paddling the Blue community.

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For those of us who also enjoy paddling whitewater boats, their newest offering

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is Online Whitewater, and they're also giving you the same discount for a listener.

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Check out onlinewhitewater.com, use the same code PTBpodcast to check out,

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and you'll get 10% off for being a member of the Paddling the Blue community.

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And I shared a trip that I took to Alaska's Prince William Sound back on episode number 50.

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While I'm doing that trip again, and if you've been considering an intro to

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Alaska, you can come along too.

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Experience the beauty of Alaska's

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Prince William Sound on this six-day experience from July 12 to 18, 2026.

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Along with peaks rising 4,000 feet from the Sound, you'll experience glaciers

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calving in the distance, catch a glimpse of the area's diverse wildlife,

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camp on remote beaches, and more.

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It's a small group experience limited to a total of six, so I hope you'll be able to join me.

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Learn more at www.paddlingtheblue.com slash Alaska.

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Enjoy today's interview with Mark Evans.

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Hi, Mark. Welcome to Paddling the Blue.

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Hi, John. Greetings from London. Oh, well, thank you for the opportunity.

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You've got a wonderfully impressive resume of expeditions. Tell us what got

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you started as an explorer.

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Well, I think that goes right back, sadly for me, many decades to when I was at school, really.

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Because I grew up in the countryside on the west of England on the Welsh border.

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And when I got off the bus at the end of every school day, you know,

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there was nothing around, John.

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So, you know, I grew up in an environment where you had to make your own entertainment

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and that often involved getting the dog, getting a fishing rod and walking across

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the fields to the nearest stream to go fishing or, you know, just...

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Backpacking up into the hills so you know

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i had a childhood which was i would say outdoorsy and

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based around exploration but i think the key thing was when i was 17 i happened

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to be listening once in school assembly and the teacher read out a little notice

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from an incredible charity that is based in the attic of the royal geographical

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society in london and this charity in a couple

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year celebrates 100 years of operations, which tells you how impactful it's been.

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And it was set up by a survivor of Scott's South Pole Expedition.

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One of the scientists that wasn't chosen to go to the pole.

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But in the pursuit of science, he saw that there were great things that people

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could learn by working together in pursuit of science.

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And so they ran expeditions every year, usually to the Arctic,

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six weeks, scientific research, adventurous travel.

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I signed up, I got chosen, not because of my skill set, but really because they

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saw a young person, a 17-year-old who could benefit from such an experience.

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And that for me was life-changing and just set me off on a life of exploration, really.

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Wow, that's fantastic. Now, what is that charity that's based in the attic?

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It's called British Exploring Society, and it's just amazing.

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It has this incredible heritage of being really born in the brain of a man who

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was spent four months in an ice cave in which it was impossible to stand up,

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survived all that, kept everyone together,

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made it safely back to Britain and set up this incredible charity in 1932.

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So they do some amazing work with all sorts of young people.

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That's incredible. So now that expedition that you went on at 17,

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tell us a little bit about that. Well, it was a six-week expedition. I.

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Six weeks living on glaciers and in glaciated valleys in the Norwegian Arctic,

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north of the Arctic Circle, just north of a community called Tromsø,

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sharing a tent with two people you'd never met in your life.

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And every day, up that mountain, up onto the ice, surveying,

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doing geology, botany, whatever, doing multiple scientific disciplines.

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But all the time, if you weren't involved in science that day,

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you'd be doing a 20-mile round trip down to the fjord, filling your backpack

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with 30 kg of food and rations and bringing them back up to base camp.

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So an incredible adventure, really.

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And then now, did you pursue adventure throughout your life or other activities as well?

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Yeah, pretty much adventures all the time, really, which resulted in me.

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So I got the bug for the Arctic in a big way from that journey.

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I got into climbing, summer climbing here in Wales and in Scotland.

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And then you progressed to Scottish winter ice and then you go to the Alps and

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I enjoyed climbing in the Alps.

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But you know, there were so many people, even when you wake up at three or four

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in the morning to do a route, when you look around you on the Argentier Glacier

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or Mont Blanc, all you see is chain after chain of head torches going up every gully.

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And a lot of people, there's nothing wrong with that. But for me,

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I just preferred the quieter places.

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And so I turned into a sort of horizontal mountaineer and went north.

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And with that same charity, I led...

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Five or six expeditions to the Arctic island of Svalbard off the north coast of Norway.

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And one of those expeditions was for an entire year. So we overwintered through

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four months of total darkness and skied across Greenland,

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followed Nansen's 1888 crossing of Greenland, and then went further west into

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northwest territories,

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did two expeditions to Melville Island in pursuit of a British explorer called

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Sir William Edward Parry.

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And so all that was fine and dandy until I realized I was in my mid to late

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20s and had a great exploration CV.

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But the only person that really wrote to me, other than my mother,

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was the bank manager because there was nothing in the bank.

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So I went into teaching for all the wrong reasons of a bit of money coming in

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and still time to do my exploration.

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So, uh, and that teaching took me to Kenya and then that was really my passport

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to the Middle East, which is where I've lived for the last 25 years.

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Okay. I was going to say that, you know, all those expeditions that you'd mentioned,

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Svalbard and the Melville islands and, uh, and all that was by your mid twenties.

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Yeah, it was pretty intense time actually. Yeah. I think, I think I peaked too

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early in life, but it was, uh, it was, uh, it was just great.

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But you know, when you're young and single, it's, it's, it's,

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you, you've got the time to do these things.

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Now, your teaching, what did you specialize in? Well, you know,

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probably other than physical education, the least academic subject of all, probably geography.

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So, it was a bit of an easy subject for me to teach because of my love for travel and exploration.

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Absolutely. And you mentioned that that led you toward the Middle East.

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So, tell us about some of your Middle East work.

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Well, the Middle East is just great. I started teaching in Britain,

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did two years in Britain, and then went out to Kenya and fell in love with Kenya,

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but then soon discovered this incredible organization called Outward Bound.

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I had a school in East Africa under the foothills of Kilimanjaro.

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So I started volunteering for them most weekends and in my school holidays and

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was having a great time in Kenya. But really, that wasn't resolving any of my

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pressing problems of getting some money in the bank because,

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you know, you're paid in Kenyan shillings.

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And as long as you stay in Kenya, that's absolutely fine. But as soon as you

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get off the plane at Heathrow and try and rent a car for a week,

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you realize just how little you're earning in reality.

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So it was it was pursuit of a tax free salary just to sort myself out once and

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for all that took me to the Middle East. And I got a job as head of geography

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and economics at a school in Bahrain.

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And I thought I would hate it because I'd spent my life in the cold climates.

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But you know what? I ended up really loving it and loving the culture and the people.

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And yeah, it's been my home for 25 years now.

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Now, as you kind of alluded to, most of your expeditions have been land-based

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with a combination of cold and now warm.

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Why take to a sea kayak at this time?

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Yeah, good question, John. Well, I volunteered, when I was at university,

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I volunteered for this incredible organization called Outward Bound.

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And Outward Bound have a school in Scotland near Fort William.

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I wrote a very speculative letter to the warden of Outward Bound in Scotland

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and not expected to hear anything.

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I offered to work for free, volunteering for...

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Six months of my summer, six weeks of my summer holidays. And lo and behold,

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he wrote back and said, look, there's a job in the equipment stores.

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It's our busy time of year.

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You work three weeks on in the stores and then we'll give you a week off.

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You can shadow the instructors and just watch what they do and learn.

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And we'll even give you a bit of pocket money, which is great.

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So I noticed there was a kayak store down near the side of the lock.

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And whenever the young people went kayaking it was in single day boats and and

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there were always one or two longer.

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Sleek very slender very graceful looking boats that never got touched and when

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it came to have my when it came to have my day off i inquired if it might be

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possible to borrow one of these boats and it was something called an anus acuta

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which is the latin name for the pintail duck this duck with a beautiful,

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long, slender, upswept tail.

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And I took this boat out on the water, so this beautiful sea kayak made by Valley Kayaks.

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And oh boy, I just fell in love with it. It was like driving a Maserati and

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just a beautiful, beautiful boat, incredibly unstable. I spent as much time

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underwater as I did on top of it.

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But once I got the hang of it, it was just beautiful.

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And I just, you know, I'd done a bit of river kayaking.

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I enjoyed the adrenaline rush and the buzz but it was overall so quickly and

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I was so focused on the water that I didn't really absorb what was going on

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around me in terms of nature and,

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I just found the tranquility of sea kayak but also the mental challenge of juggling

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the tides and the weather and the currents and looking at the charts and all

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that kind of stuff I just discovered a world that I really really enjoyed and

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and I've been sea kayaking ever since all All right.

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I think it certainly sounds like you've caught the bug for the same reasons

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that many of us have as well.

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So from that first experience in the Anasakuda, tell us about some of your sea kayak experiences.

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Well, many really around the northwest coast of Wales, around Anglesey,

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and then west coast of Scotland. So I live on the east coast of Scotland.

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Over on the west, as you probably know, there's some beautiful islands and sheltered

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waters and some great country, apart from the midges, but in the summer.

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But so lots of hiking there.

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My friend Nigel Harling got a Winston Churchill Memorial grant many years ago when we,

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We bought an Aleut 2, which is this huge Expedition Double Sea kayak, which bolts together.

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And we tried to kayak around the northern coast of Svalbard,

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this island only 500 miles from the North Pole.

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We got quite a way. We got a Russian icebreaker to take us as far as our credit cards could stomach.

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And then they winched us over the side and we were off with a rifle for polar

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bears and a waterproof bag on the deck between us. and about three weeks or

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four weeks worth of food and fuel.

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And kayaking around northwest Svalbard is extraordinary because there aren't many bits of flat land.

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Those bits that are flat are full of the graves of whalers from hundreds of years ago.

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And so it's not unusual to be paddling past ribcages and with all the frost

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heave and the ice churning in the ground since they were buried because they

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couldn't be buried in the ground because of the permafrost.

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So the rocks were just piled on top of them. And there were hundreds of whalers,

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sailors who died there centuries ago.

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So, you know, trying to find somewhere to camp where you haven't got a skull

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staring straight at you is pretty tricky there.

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And polar bears also, you've got to be on your toes a wee bit.

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And some pretty committing paddling, you know.

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There was a place down the west coast, the Seven Glaciers. and just glacier after glacier.

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So it's just a wall of ice for, you know, for mile after mile.

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So if you fall in, you know, there's no way you're going to get to shore and get out.

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You've got to get yourselves back in. And so quite committing paddling,

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but really exhilarating and really interesting stuff.

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And then I paddled around, I tried to paddle around the coastline of Oman many

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years ago, but then I was teaching and I was limited to holidays.

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So I didn't quite complete that journey due to lack of time.

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Well, the experience in Svalbard where everything has either died or is trying

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to eat you, sounds quite interesting.

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Yeah, it is. Yeah, life takes on a certain pace when you're not on top of the

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food chain, that's for sure.

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So you mentioned Oman. And so tell us about, you said you tried to paddle around

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the coast of Oman, but you're doing that again. So tell us about that.

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Yeah. So the first time I tried to kayak around Oman, it was 20 years ago, John.

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And the world was different then. So I just saw an opportunity to replay that journey.

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But now I have the time not to have to rush it, not to have to rush anywhere,

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to do it in its entirety and to travel slowly. No need to rush.

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But what's different? What's different is that next year is the first COP dedicated

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purely to oceans taking place in Kenya.

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And so oceans are in the spotlight right

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now we launched this next project it's

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called oman 3165 3165 is

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the length of the coastline of oman in

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kilometers so your listeners can go to oman3165.com and there they'll find everything

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they need to know about the expedition and the podcasts that we'll be doing

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and the idea is that we will i will paddle from the north in the straits of Hormuz near Iran,

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around the coast of Oman and down to the border with Yemen down in the far south.

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And that'll take me, you know, don't know, maybe about 70 days.

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I think it's whether it's shorter or faster or short or further,

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it really doesn't matter, but I think it'll probably take me about 70 days.

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And what is your preparation for a trip like this?

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Well, the theory or the reality. The theory is, of course, I should be in,

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I should be, you know, first of all, John, you know, falling in,

00:16:27.646 --> 00:16:30.146
in Oman, it sounds like I fall in a lot.

00:16:30.266 --> 00:16:36.526
I don't, but you know, it's, it's a pleasure to fall in, in Oman because the water is warm.

00:16:36.686 --> 00:16:40.786
You know, you can, I could be in there all day and it really wouldn't matter.

00:16:41.046 --> 00:16:44.586
But, you know, falling in in Scotland is a slightly different kettle of fish.

00:16:44.726 --> 00:16:50.346
So in theory, of course, we launched this journey last week here in London,

00:16:50.366 --> 00:16:55.186
or September the 25th and we launched it at the Royal Geographical Society which

00:16:55.186 --> 00:16:59.806
is the home of exploration and we chose September the 25th because it is the

00:16:59.806 --> 00:17:01.886
International Maritime Organization

00:17:01.886 --> 00:17:07.446
World Maritime Day and the focus this year it's called Our Ocean,

00:17:07.726 --> 00:17:10.466
Our Obligation, Our Opportunity.

00:17:11.113 --> 00:17:17.313
So we'll start paddling on the 11th of the 11th. So November the 11th.

00:17:17.453 --> 00:17:21.533
It might be a couple of days after that, depending on various things that we can control.

00:17:21.673 --> 00:17:25.313
But about that date, we'll start the journey in the north.

00:17:25.493 --> 00:17:30.813
And of course, that's now only six weeks away. So I should be in the peak of physical condition.

00:17:31.053 --> 00:17:34.973
I should be paddling and training every day or every other day.

00:17:34.973 --> 00:17:38.373
And I've got no excuse because I've got a river at the bottom of my garden in

00:17:38.373 --> 00:17:42.353
Scotland. But sadly for me, six weeks ago, I went flying over the handlebars

00:17:42.353 --> 00:17:44.953
on my mountain bike and I broke two ribs.

00:17:45.073 --> 00:17:48.133
But most infuriatingly, I broke my left wrist.

00:17:48.333 --> 00:17:51.933
So I had the cast off about 10, 12 days ago.

00:17:52.093 --> 00:17:56.473
Now it's getting better by the day. I've still got six weeks for it to get better.

00:17:56.733 --> 00:18:02.953
And so if people happen to walk past my house in Scotland, they'll see a crazy

00:18:02.953 --> 00:18:06.213
Englishman standing in his garden with a kayak paddle in his hand.

00:18:06.213 --> 00:18:07.873
So I'm whirring my paddle around

00:18:07.873 --> 00:18:11.653
as if I'm on the water, which is as brave as I can be at the moment,

00:18:11.813 --> 00:18:18.313
but just trying to get all the joints used to that motion and just get my wrist

00:18:18.313 --> 00:18:22.493
stronger and stronger in the hope that it'll hold out when I start the journey in November.

00:18:22.813 --> 00:18:26.513
So aside from physical preparation in your garden and elsewhere,

00:18:26.753 --> 00:18:29.673
what is the logistical preparation like for the trip?

00:18:29.673 --> 00:18:33.053
Uh well reasonably straightforward actually

00:18:33.053 --> 00:18:36.273
it's uh i've got i've got uh the boats have been built here

00:18:36.273 --> 00:18:39.133
in nottingham so by my friends at valley

00:18:39.133 --> 00:18:42.473
kayaks and when i tried this journey

00:18:42.473 --> 00:18:45.353
20 years ago i had a nordcap which

00:18:45.353 --> 00:18:51.253
is the kind of original sea kayak design you know this year i think is the 50th

00:18:51.253 --> 00:18:56.613
year since that boat was first produced so it's a real milestone year for for

00:18:56.613 --> 00:19:01.353
for the nordcap And so those boats have been built there next week,

00:19:01.373 --> 00:19:03.093
I hope. They'll be shipped out to Oman.

00:19:03.993 --> 00:19:09.613
And we've got a whole raft of companies behind the project, one of whom providing

00:19:09.613 --> 00:19:11.893
us with a four-wheel drive vehicle.

00:19:11.993 --> 00:19:17.053
So whilst I'm on the water, there'll be a land-based team who will look after

00:19:17.053 --> 00:19:18.433
me, just check them okay.

00:19:18.833 --> 00:19:23.613
They'll be flying a drone and running sort of a mobile base camp and comms center.

00:19:23.613 --> 00:19:27.653
So most times we'll come together at the end of every day, but there'll be certainly

00:19:27.653 --> 00:19:31.233
times when we can't because of the nature of the coastline. So I'll be on my own.

00:19:31.893 --> 00:19:35.533
I'll obviously have tent and stove and food and water on my kayak for a few

00:19:35.533 --> 00:19:38.093
days just to deal with that potential.

00:19:38.868 --> 00:19:41.608
Situation. But, you know, really the logistics are pretty simple.

00:19:41.808 --> 00:19:44.868
I've still got a lot of my camping gear out there and, you know,

00:19:44.988 --> 00:19:48.008
there are no dry suits or wetsuits required.

00:19:48.248 --> 00:19:52.168
It's kayaking in a t-shirt and short. Your biggest enemy is the sun.

00:19:52.408 --> 00:19:57.548
And so it's just protecting yourself from it. And that sun also influences the sea state.

00:19:57.788 --> 00:20:02.608
So I'll be aiming to start paddling about 4.30 every morning.

00:20:03.228 --> 00:20:07.668
Sunrise will be about 6.30 every morning. So during the night,

00:20:07.668 --> 00:20:10.468
the sea calms down and and at dawn it's

00:20:10.468 --> 00:20:13.248
like a mirror usually it's like a mill pond it's beautiful i can

00:20:13.248 --> 00:20:16.768
do about seven kilometers an hour for hour after hour and and

00:20:16.768 --> 00:20:19.708
by the time you get to mid morning 10 11 o'clock i've

00:20:19.708 --> 00:20:24.668
done 30 35k which is you know getting towards the end of enough you know i intend

00:20:24.668 --> 00:20:30.428
to approach it in especially with my wrist issue just everest base camp style

00:20:30.428 --> 00:20:35.728
you know just walk bit by bit and paddle myself fit but you know incrementally

00:20:35.728 --> 00:20:38.988
build up the distance in the first 10 days,

00:20:39.168 --> 00:20:41.768
two weeks, because I don't want to overstretch myself.

00:20:42.088 --> 00:20:45.828
But about 10 o'clock, 11 o'clock every day, you know, the sun's starting to

00:20:45.828 --> 00:20:48.648
warm up and you're actually looking forward to a waft of wind.

00:20:48.888 --> 00:20:52.948
And pretty much you can certainly watch that waft of wind will come at about

00:20:52.948 --> 00:20:55.148
10 or 11 o'clock in the morning.

00:20:55.348 --> 00:20:58.588
And that's caused by the land heating up faster than the sea.

00:20:58.808 --> 00:21:02.288
So the air over the desert will rise.

00:21:02.528 --> 00:21:06.408
It'll pull in air from the ocean. So you get this onshore breeze kicking in.

00:21:06.828 --> 00:21:09.588
And that builds up and up and up and up into the early, but,

00:21:09.608 --> 00:21:14.988
you know, early afternoon, what was a mirror of a sea is now quite choppy.

00:21:15.108 --> 00:21:19.368
But, you know, I will be off the water by 11 o'clock midday every day because

00:21:19.368 --> 00:21:23.048
we've got too much to do. We've got a lot of science and education to do on this project, too.

00:21:23.468 --> 00:21:27.368
So speaking of that, so there's certainly more to this trip than you paddling

00:21:27.368 --> 00:21:31.068
3,165 kilometers along the coast of Oman.

00:21:31.468 --> 00:21:35.628
You mentioned science and exploration. So tell us about that part and why this is important.

00:21:36.338 --> 00:21:40.198
I like to do what I do with a purpose. And so science and education,

00:21:40.318 --> 00:21:43.418
education in particular inspire the next generation, really important to me.

00:21:43.538 --> 00:21:47.058
And so in terms of science, we'll be doing a few firsts.

00:21:47.398 --> 00:21:52.038
We've partnered with an incredible New Zealand environmental company called WilderLab.

00:21:52.258 --> 00:21:58.318
And they very kindly have provided me with some free eDNA sampling kits.

00:21:58.798 --> 00:22:01.878
And eDNA is the way now in

00:22:01.878 --> 00:22:04.598
terms of monitoring the state of the ocean you know

00:22:04.598 --> 00:22:07.558
every living organism from protozoa to blue whales

00:22:07.558 --> 00:22:13.918
shed dna one way or another through mucus or poo or just you know bits of your

00:22:13.918 --> 00:22:18.598
body dropping off i mean we're both shedding e-dna now as we record this podcast

00:22:18.598 --> 00:22:23.978
and so so i'll be taking samples periodically systematically around the coastline

00:22:23.978 --> 00:22:27.178
of omar it's not the water that i send off to New Zealand,

00:22:27.238 --> 00:22:30.358
it'll be the filters through which I draw that water.

00:22:31.138 --> 00:22:37.258
And then within two weeks, they will come back with an incredibly complex biological

00:22:37.258 --> 00:22:43.338
living tree diagram of what has been in that water in recent weeks.

00:22:43.558 --> 00:22:45.078
And it's just extraordinary.

00:22:45.378 --> 00:22:49.458
Nat Geo are using it right now in a big project called Pristine Seas off to Minica.

00:22:50.112 --> 00:22:54.412
It's really revolutionizing ocean research. It's never been done in the waters

00:22:54.412 --> 00:22:57.812
of Oman before. So we're really excited by that.

00:22:58.112 --> 00:23:01.232
And we're also, of course, you

00:23:01.232 --> 00:23:03.972
know, there's a hell of a lot going to be going on underneath my kayak.

00:23:04.192 --> 00:23:09.452
So the waters of Oman are nutrient rich and absolutely prolific with life,

00:23:09.732 --> 00:23:13.012
from turtles to tuna to sea snakes to humpback.

00:23:13.132 --> 00:23:15.932
Humpback the only population of humpback whales in the world

00:23:15.932 --> 00:23:19.112
that don't migrate because the monsoon brings the hot

00:23:19.112 --> 00:23:22.332
and the cold water to them so i'll be towing underneath

00:23:22.332 --> 00:23:29.332
my boat five meter cable with a hydrophone and so i'll be recording what's happening

00:23:29.332 --> 00:23:32.932
underneath you know i won't be able to hear it but that's where the specialists

00:23:32.932 --> 00:23:37.152
at saint andrews university in scotland come in the sea mammal research unit

00:23:37.152 --> 00:23:40.812
uh you know we'll have at the end of every day and this will be the job of the

00:23:40.812 --> 00:23:42.052
team in the support vehicle,

00:23:42.252 --> 00:23:45.432
be a hell of a lot of data that will need to be downloaded.

00:23:46.092 --> 00:23:49.012
Uploaded to be accessed by the scientists around the world.

00:23:49.192 --> 00:23:53.572
And then, you know, off I go again the next day harvesting the data in my kayak.

00:23:53.812 --> 00:23:56.472
So, you know, that's the science work we're going to be doing.

00:23:56.872 --> 00:24:00.232
And how did you get connected with the scientific team for this?

00:24:00.692 --> 00:24:07.792
Oh, just reaching out, John, to, you know, key people that I knew who were loosely connected to this.

00:24:07.892 --> 00:24:11.152
And it's like the sea kayak world it's actually a pretty small it's

00:24:11.152 --> 00:24:14.052
a pretty small network of people and once you start talking to

00:24:14.052 --> 00:24:16.812
one or two they'll always say well you know what you should talk to this

00:24:16.812 --> 00:24:19.792
guy you should talk to this girl she's incredible and and

00:24:19.792 --> 00:24:25.012
you know the network grows and you know it's just at the launch last week you

00:24:25.012 --> 00:24:30.312
know a room full of extraordinary people doing amazing things and so we've got

00:24:30.312 --> 00:24:34.552
science on one side but we've got education on the other and we're doing some

00:24:34.552 --> 00:24:38.092
great work with some educational charities here in the UK.

00:24:38.949 --> 00:24:41.789
Probably every other day, when we're on the beach and all sorted,

00:24:41.929 --> 00:24:46.629
there'll be Zoom conversations with thousands of young people in the UK and

00:24:46.629 --> 00:24:49.269
also in the USA and Canada.

00:24:49.269 --> 00:24:54.149
We've partnered with an amazing guy called Joe Globowski, exploring by the seat

00:24:54.149 --> 00:24:57.169
of your pants, so bringing expeditions into classrooms.

00:24:57.169 --> 00:25:02.449
So we'll be engaging and hopefully inspiring young people all around the world

00:25:02.449 --> 00:25:09.649
into why oceans are important and why the way we dispose of our litter is important

00:25:09.649 --> 00:25:11.589
and all sorts of things like that.

00:25:11.829 --> 00:25:14.909
What do you expect to be your greatest challenge along the trip?

00:25:15.589 --> 00:25:21.329
Well, the sun is a big challenge every day, but that's relentless and you do

00:25:21.329 --> 00:25:24.769
get used to that. And I think the biggest challenge from my memory of trying

00:25:24.769 --> 00:25:28.769
it 20 or so years ago, John, was when you turn the corner.

00:25:28.909 --> 00:25:33.529
So if you look at a map of Oman, there's a kind of a right angle turn.

00:25:33.729 --> 00:25:38.809
And at that right angle, that's the most easterly point of the entire Arabic

00:25:38.809 --> 00:25:41.169
speaking world, a place called Ras Salhad.

00:25:41.809 --> 00:25:45.969
And at that point, the Gulf of Oman becomes the Indian Ocean.

00:25:46.329 --> 00:25:49.669
And that ocean is enormous. And then you're exposed to quite a big swell.

00:25:49.669 --> 00:25:52.809
And so if my day is not

00:25:52.809 --> 00:25:55.769
going to plan and I'm on the water a wee bit too long you

00:25:55.769 --> 00:25:59.229
know some of the surf I've got to land through is pretty

00:25:59.229 --> 00:26:03.089
meaty stuff so I remember a few dish dishwasher like

00:26:03.089 --> 00:26:07.889
moments on the last trip so I'll try and avoid those this time if I can but

00:26:07.889 --> 00:26:12.289
it's you know it's there is a big swell and uh and and so the waters will be

00:26:12.289 --> 00:26:16.989
quite different and yeah that's that's really about it it's it's not there's

00:26:16.989 --> 00:26:19.889
nothing technically difficult as long as I keep the land to my right.

00:26:20.349 --> 00:26:23.769
Navigation isn't an issue. It's not.

00:26:24.591 --> 00:26:29.551
It's not a circumnavigation because much of Oman is landlocked to the northern

00:26:29.551 --> 00:26:34.031
border and the western border, but it's very much following a coastline and

00:26:34.031 --> 00:26:37.911
just enjoying it and not enduring it.

00:26:38.451 --> 00:26:41.791
Looking at the map and looking at the coast, it looks pretty desolate.

00:26:42.231 --> 00:26:47.151
Once you get away from those cities near the Straits of Hormuz and then down

00:26:47.151 --> 00:26:50.531
a little further, what do you expect to find other than water?

00:26:51.071 --> 00:26:54.871
Well, I mean, there are a lot of land features, actually. It just doesn't show

00:26:54.871 --> 00:26:57.051
up when you look at a 2D map.

00:26:57.231 --> 00:26:59.751
I mean, there are mountains that go up to 10,000 feet in Oman.

00:27:00.011 --> 00:27:05.311
And, you know, we have a few days of snow and ice every year there and in the depths of winter.

00:27:05.511 --> 00:27:09.051
So the start will be, you know, my challenge in the first two or three days

00:27:09.051 --> 00:27:12.691
will be finding somewhere to get off the water because the mountains come straight

00:27:12.691 --> 00:27:14.431
down into the sea. It's really dramatic.

00:27:14.951 --> 00:27:18.871
And then just incredible coastline of sand dunes coming down.

00:27:18.871 --> 00:27:23.391
There's an area of desert, which is one of only three fog deserts in the world.

00:27:23.531 --> 00:27:28.711
The others being in Namibia, the Skeleton Coast, and the Chilean Desert.

00:27:29.211 --> 00:27:32.851
But there's an area of enormous sand dunes that come down into the sea,

00:27:32.891 --> 00:27:34.011
which are quite spectacular.

00:27:34.551 --> 00:27:40.631
And then large areas of mangroves, and then some incredible rocky headlands

00:27:40.631 --> 00:27:45.791
again, and then some lovely white sweeping beaches with lagoons full of flamingos.

00:27:45.791 --> 00:27:50.871
And then at the end, into some really big mountainous cliffs again.

00:27:51.131 --> 00:27:54.171
But this time, you're in the land of the hyena and the Arabian leopard,

00:27:54.171 --> 00:28:00.771
and the cliffs are covered in frankincense forest, which is just a beautiful

00:28:00.771 --> 00:28:04.091
way to end what I hope will be a magical journey.

00:28:04.651 --> 00:28:10.251
Wow. Well, I certainly show my naivete of the Oman coast, and it sounds much

00:28:10.251 --> 00:28:13.331
more spectacular than I expected than what appears on a map.

00:28:14.157 --> 00:28:18.777
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, as I've learned in the past, Google Earth is great,

00:28:18.917 --> 00:28:20.197
but there's a lot it doesn't tell you.

00:28:21.337 --> 00:28:25.417
Is sea kayaking very popular in Oman? It's an area of the world that we don't

00:28:25.417 --> 00:28:30.777
get a chance to talk about much. Yeah, and purposely so, John,

00:28:30.857 --> 00:28:33.597
because Oman chooses politically to fly under the radar.

00:28:33.857 --> 00:28:36.057
It's the Switzerland of the Middle East.

00:28:36.877 --> 00:28:43.217
It's a country full of humility, but quietly always working behind the scenes

00:28:43.217 --> 00:28:49.097
to get hostages released from Somalia or Iran, but not wanting to take credit

00:28:49.097 --> 00:28:50.757
for it, not wanting to be front of stage.

00:28:50.757 --> 00:28:53.677
So it's, you know, most people don't know much about Oman.

00:28:53.937 --> 00:28:56.937
It's, you know, just to give you a bit of perspective, it's the size of UK,

00:28:57.197 --> 00:28:58.777
but with only 5 million people.

00:28:58.937 --> 00:29:03.117
So imagine UK with only half the population of London.

00:29:03.397 --> 00:29:08.977
So much of it, as you rightly said, is wilderness and which makes it a gorgeous place to travel in.

00:29:09.077 --> 00:29:11.557
But in terms of sea kayaking, because of the small population,

00:29:11.837 --> 00:29:18.097
very few people, you know, I've seen one or two people kayaking around the capital

00:29:18.097 --> 00:29:20.997
city, Muscat, but not really.

00:29:21.177 --> 00:29:28.337
I've never seen, you know, I was on the water for 55 consecutive days last 20 years ago.

00:29:28.417 --> 00:29:32.697
I didn't see a single sea kayaker anywhere and lived there for 23 years.

00:29:32.857 --> 00:29:37.597
And other than seeing one or two people recreationally out at weekends on the

00:29:37.597 --> 00:29:43.417
capital city, then absolutely nothing. A lot of people paddle surf kayaks or

00:29:43.417 --> 00:29:45.797
whatever you call them, these sort of fishing sit-on-top kayaks.

00:29:45.877 --> 00:29:50.397
But in terms of expedition kayaks, I've really not seen anyone.

00:29:50.877 --> 00:29:56.517
And is there much of a tourism activity there? Yeah, huge tourism actually.

00:29:56.917 --> 00:30:04.777
And that's seen and hailed as one of the great ways to decarbonize the economy

00:30:04.777 --> 00:30:08.857
and shift away from an oil-based economy, which it primarily is,

00:30:08.997 --> 00:30:09.977
but increasingly less so.

00:30:09.977 --> 00:30:12.897
You know oman's doing a really good job of diversifying its economy

00:30:12.897 --> 00:30:15.937
into and there's a lot of tourism there and

00:30:15.937 --> 00:30:19.817
it's growing and and unsurprisingly everyone

00:30:19.817 --> 00:30:24.137
who goes there just falls in love with it you know the fact that i spent 23

00:30:24.137 --> 00:30:27.777
years there john tells you all you need to know about oman it's if you love

00:30:27.777 --> 00:30:33.397
the outdoors it's absolutely paradise it's really gorgeous now what is the uh

00:30:33.397 --> 00:30:38.117
the outdoor draw there if not water is it is it land or what's what are people going there for.

00:30:38.878 --> 00:30:42.178
I think culture and heritage as much as anything else.

00:30:42.378 --> 00:30:46.738
You know, it's not a Dubai is just up the road, five hours drive up the road,

00:30:46.858 --> 00:30:48.438
but they're chalk and cheese, really.

00:30:48.678 --> 00:30:54.978
Oman has done a great job of retaining its heritage, retaining its culture,

00:30:55.338 --> 00:30:56.538
retaining its identity.

00:30:57.198 --> 00:31:04.218
And you bolt onto that, that incredible Arab hospitality. So me taking an Inuit

00:31:04.218 --> 00:31:10.638
Greenland design kayak to Oman, it's a kind of fusion of Inuit and Bedouin cultures.

00:31:10.978 --> 00:31:14.518
But actually, it's not just my kayak that unites them.

00:31:14.858 --> 00:31:19.418
I would say that the Inuits and the Bedouin, what they have in common is that

00:31:19.418 --> 00:31:22.978
both peoples live on the edge of human tolerance.

00:31:23.278 --> 00:31:26.358
One on the edge of cold, one on the edge of heat.

00:31:26.358 --> 00:31:29.418
And I think those extremities bring

00:31:29.418 --> 00:31:32.138
out the best in people and I think it was the

00:31:32.138 --> 00:31:35.898
desert explorer Wilfred Thessage who said the heart of the life the finder the

00:31:35.898 --> 00:31:40.898
person and that hospitality that you receive in Arabia is just the same as you

00:31:40.898 --> 00:31:46.438
receive from the people of the far north you know it's absolutely genuine and

00:31:46.438 --> 00:31:50.398
I think you know a lot of travelers come for the culture the heritage to the

00:31:50.398 --> 00:31:51.718
incredible hospitality,

00:31:51.758 --> 00:31:57.058
but also this spectacular landscape of 10,000-foot mountains,

00:31:57.458 --> 00:31:59.218
incredible coastline and diving.

00:31:59.838 --> 00:32:03.438
Getting out into the desert, into some of these beautiful desert camps and seeing

00:32:03.438 --> 00:32:07.938
that incredible starry sky come out at night.

00:32:07.938 --> 00:32:10.938
It's quite extraordinary, really. It does sound spectacular.

00:32:11.318 --> 00:32:17.138
So do you get the local people involved in any of the trip? Absolutely, I do.

00:32:17.398 --> 00:32:21.778
Yeah. So paddling alongside me will be my friend Mohamed Zajali, who is an Omani.

00:32:22.258 --> 00:32:27.538
And that's very important. So for the last 13, 14 years of my time in Oman,

00:32:27.838 --> 00:32:32.638
I worked with Mohamed and a bunch of other young people to establish outward

00:32:32.638 --> 00:32:37.118
bound in Oman, the first outward bound in any Arabic speaking nation.

00:32:37.118 --> 00:32:41.558
And now, you know, they're absolutely flying. They've got 45 full-time staff.

00:32:41.858 --> 00:32:46.398
They've trained 32,000 young people and using the deserts and the mountains.

00:32:46.718 --> 00:32:49.618
But now they're moving on to the ocean. And guess what?

00:32:49.718 --> 00:32:52.858
They've just bought a fleet of double kayaks.

00:32:52.938 --> 00:32:57.918
And so I will be stopping in to talk to them and do a podcast with them.

00:32:57.918 --> 00:32:59.678
So Mohamed will be with me when I start.

00:32:59.878 --> 00:33:02.998
I'm not sure how long he can stay because he's got a proper job he's got to get back to.

00:33:03.358 --> 00:33:08.198
But certainly when I reach Muscat, I'll be making a point of going to visit

00:33:08.198 --> 00:33:12.878
them on the water and just talking to them about their kayaking in Oman,

00:33:12.978 --> 00:33:14.698
which has really just started to take off.

00:33:15.178 --> 00:33:17.778
Well, it sounds like a spectacular place and a wonderful journey.

00:33:17.958 --> 00:33:19.478
So how will you document the trip?

00:33:20.090 --> 00:33:24.530
Well, we'll be, you know, in the old days, John, I used to write a daily diary,

00:33:24.670 --> 00:33:27.630
but I don't bother anymore because we podcast all the way.

00:33:27.830 --> 00:33:31.470
So if you go on to Spotify or Apple, wherever you get your podcasts,

00:33:31.630 --> 00:33:37.870
if people go on and search Omar 3165, the second podcast just went live at nine

00:33:37.870 --> 00:33:39.290
o'clock London time today.

00:33:39.710 --> 00:33:44.030
And that's the podcast that covers the launch last week. So people will be able

00:33:44.030 --> 00:33:46.370
to track us via the podcast.

00:33:46.610 --> 00:33:49.450
But if they go to the website, they'll also be able to track us.

00:33:49.450 --> 00:33:52.070
We're working with the Durham University.

00:33:52.250 --> 00:33:57.910
I'll have an Insta360 camera on my kayak, and every day I'll be sending 360

00:33:57.910 --> 00:34:04.990
imagery to Durham, and they will be creating, if you're into virtual reality, put your goggles on.

00:34:05.130 --> 00:34:09.710
You'll be able to follow me and do a complete sort of interactive 360 look at

00:34:09.710 --> 00:34:12.650
the water and the landscape, which I'm paddling through.

00:34:12.810 --> 00:34:16.570
And you'll be able to access all of that through the website once the journey starts.

00:34:16.570 --> 00:34:19.910
So I won't be documenting it in a in

00:34:19.910 --> 00:34:22.990
a sort of written form but it'll be audio visual and social

00:34:22.990 --> 00:34:28.050
media well it sounds like quite an experience and quite immersive so I'll make

00:34:28.050 --> 00:34:31.930
sure we include links in the show notes so folks can check that out and follow

00:34:31.930 --> 00:34:37.750
along with you now 11 11 25 why did you pick that specific date well I would

00:34:37.750 --> 00:34:41.150
have started earlier John if I could but which I'm in

00:34:41.270 --> 00:34:44.570
now because tonight I'm doing a lecture at the Royal Geographical Society.

00:34:44.710 --> 00:34:50.790
We did a 30-day journey earlier this year on camel through Oman.

00:34:51.250 --> 00:34:54.850
And the book of that has just been published. We just got it.

00:34:54.930 --> 00:34:56.890
The first copies have just reached us from the printers.

00:34:57.350 --> 00:35:02.530
In London, in the first week of November every year, is an enormous travel and

00:35:02.530 --> 00:35:06.710
trade fair called WTM, the World Travel Market.

00:35:06.890 --> 00:35:09.770
And it's utterly huge. Every country in the world that has

00:35:09.770 --> 00:35:14.790
any bit of tourism will have a representative desk there trying to out compete

00:35:14.790 --> 00:35:20.470
and shout louder than the neighbours and so the Minister of Heritage and Tourism

00:35:20.470 --> 00:35:28.230
from Oman will be in London for that and he is very keen that we use that opportunity to launch,

00:35:29.021 --> 00:35:33.801
And so I cannot travel before that has happened. And that happens on November the 6th.

00:35:33.961 --> 00:35:38.301
So as soon as that's done, straight to the airport, fly out to Muscat on the 7th.

00:35:39.001 --> 00:35:41.641
Then we'll have about three or four days to get everything ready,

00:35:41.881 --> 00:35:44.281
kayaks on the roof rack, drive north.

00:35:44.661 --> 00:35:50.621
It could take us half a day to drive north and camp up and get ready to launch hopefully on the 11th.

00:35:50.681 --> 00:35:53.861
If not the 11th, it'll be the 12th or the 13th about then. Okay.

00:35:54.341 --> 00:35:57.581
Any sponsors that you'd like to give recognition to?

00:35:58.441 --> 00:36:03.081
Thank you. That's a very kind question to ask, John. Yeah, so Asyad Shipping

00:36:03.081 --> 00:36:05.501
is Oman's biggest shipping company.

00:36:05.741 --> 00:36:09.561
And, you know, I always think long and hard when it comes to sponsors because

00:36:09.561 --> 00:36:11.121
their values have to resonate.

00:36:11.361 --> 00:36:15.461
And so, you know, often when you're doing expeditions in the Middle East,

00:36:15.481 --> 00:36:19.861
it's easy to go to the oil and gas companies like Aramco and Shell and BP.

00:36:20.041 --> 00:36:25.881
But actually, you know, a lot of people don't like to be connected to that carbon

00:36:25.881 --> 00:36:30.901
based industry anymore. So I try and shy away from the oil and gas people.

00:36:31.101 --> 00:36:36.541
And so I'm always very sort of forensic when it comes to partners. And Asia are great.

00:36:36.801 --> 00:36:41.681
And they really do walk the walk when it comes to sustainability.

00:36:42.101 --> 00:36:46.501
And do some really innovative stuff with wind turbines on the decks of their

00:36:46.501 --> 00:36:50.981
boats, these huge carriers that go across the oceans. And just great.

00:36:51.741 --> 00:36:54.401
It was a meeting of minds, really, when I

00:36:54.401 --> 00:36:57.501
went to them to talk about would they support this project

00:36:57.501 --> 00:37:00.561
and and of course with with world maritime day

00:37:00.561 --> 00:37:03.721
i mean they're very keen to and rightly very

00:37:03.721 --> 00:37:06.461
proud of what they do in terms of sustainability so we've got

00:37:06.461 --> 00:37:09.281
we've got as you had we've got vodafone as well

00:37:09.281 --> 00:37:13.961
who are our comms partners so they're giving us free unlimited data sim cards

00:37:13.961 --> 00:37:18.481
which enable us to have these interactions with young people all around the

00:37:18.481 --> 00:37:23.601
world through zoom and a few other partners too wilder lab the incredible people

00:37:23.601 --> 00:37:26.521
in new zealand who have given us these free eDNA kits.

00:37:26.681 --> 00:37:31.381
So the list goes on. If you look at the website, you'll see there's an entire

00:37:31.381 --> 00:37:35.241
podcast just talking about that community, actually. So I better stop there.

00:37:35.521 --> 00:37:39.481
All right. And again, can you just remind everybody of the website and how folks

00:37:39.481 --> 00:37:41.081
can connect with the expedition and yourself?

00:37:41.661 --> 00:37:48.521
People can follow us, John, through the website, which is www.oman3165.com.

00:37:48.841 --> 00:37:53.501
And there you'll be able to access all the podcasts, social media feeds,

00:37:53.501 --> 00:37:57.961
And there's a track the journey icon, which, of course, at the moment is inactive.

00:37:58.241 --> 00:38:03.201
But once we start, then you'll be able to see where we are. We're using something

00:38:03.201 --> 00:38:05.621
called a yellow brick tracker that many of your listeners will know.

00:38:05.781 --> 00:38:10.701
But on top of that, we're layering on this virtual reality 360 degree imagery.

00:38:11.221 --> 00:38:15.861
Fantastic. So before we begin to wrap up here, I've got one other question for

00:38:15.861 --> 00:38:17.761
actually two other questions, but one first.

00:38:18.061 --> 00:38:21.821
Tell us about the MBE designation following your name.

00:38:22.661 --> 00:38:28.121
Oh, well, MBE is a member of the British Empire. And so that's one of the...

00:38:28.742 --> 00:38:35.342
One of the medals that get dished out to fortunate individuals like me, really, by Britain.

00:38:35.822 --> 00:38:39.602
And so I think, gosh, I can't remember now, John, it's probably 10 years ago.

00:38:39.802 --> 00:38:41.682
And you never know who nominates you.

00:38:42.142 --> 00:38:44.802
So, yeah, a really special day for me, really.

00:38:46.882 --> 00:38:55.202
I think I was recognized for my work in the field of outdoor learning and using

00:38:55.202 --> 00:39:01.182
the outdoors to promote a greater understanding of the Arab world and promote

00:39:01.182 --> 00:39:02.262
intercultural dialogue.

00:39:02.502 --> 00:39:06.942
I set up something called the University of the Desert, which brings young leaders

00:39:06.942 --> 00:39:08.422
together from all around the world.

00:39:08.642 --> 00:39:12.682
And always lovely to have a pat on the back, but completely unexpected.

00:39:13.022 --> 00:39:16.502
And so that's what it stands for, MBEs, Member of the British Empire.

00:39:16.802 --> 00:39:21.022
Yes, well, congratulations on that designation, being a member of the British

00:39:21.022 --> 00:39:27.562
Empire, and for your work in the scientific exploration exploration and furthering the outdoors.

00:39:28.022 --> 00:39:32.082
So, thank you. I do have one final question for you, and that is,

00:39:32.222 --> 00:39:35.442
who else would you like to hear as a future guest on Peddling the Blue?

00:39:35.962 --> 00:39:38.762
Gosh, well, John, I have no idea who you spoke to in the past,

00:39:38.822 --> 00:39:43.682
but the two people that spring to mind immediately are Peter and Jason,

00:39:43.802 --> 00:39:47.282
the guys behind Valley Sea Kayaks.

00:39:47.462 --> 00:39:51.042
You know, they were the people that, going right back to our earlier conversation

00:39:51.042 --> 00:39:53.362
about that Anasakuta that was made by Valley.

00:39:53.522 --> 00:39:57.442
I always remember seeing the sticker inside the hull of the boat.

00:39:57.622 --> 00:40:02.942
So for me, Valley have always been synonymous with quality and the heritage of sea kayaking.

00:40:03.142 --> 00:40:08.882
And so when I wanted two boats building for this 3165 journey, I went to Valley.

00:40:09.142 --> 00:40:12.402
I met Pete and Jason. They're just lovely, lovely people.

00:40:12.662 --> 00:40:19.042
And so they are the sort of co-directors of Valley Sea Kayaks and doing really well.

00:40:19.202 --> 00:40:24.442
And so their knowledge of the heritage of sea kayaking and the 50 years of this

00:40:24.442 --> 00:40:30.282
incredible kayak, I'd suggest you talk to them because they'd have a great story to share.

00:40:30.662 --> 00:40:33.902
All right. Well, we will definitely work with you to connect with them.

00:40:34.022 --> 00:40:38.342
And thank you very much for the opportunity to talk about Oman 3165,

00:40:38.522 --> 00:40:44.022
your kayak expedition coming up in November of 2025 along the coastline of Oman

00:40:44.022 --> 00:40:46.422
with the science component of that.

00:40:46.582 --> 00:40:50.442
And so we will look forward to making sure that folks can follow along with

00:40:50.442 --> 00:40:53.122
that. and maybe we'll get a chance to talk to you while you're on the trip and

00:40:53.122 --> 00:40:55.322
experience some of that science right alongside you.

00:40:55.922 --> 00:40:58.882
For sure, yeah, we can do that. Yeah, thanks very much, John.

00:40:59.082 --> 00:41:00.622
You're welcome. Thank you, Mark. Thank you.

00:41:02.285 --> 00:41:05.845
If you want to be a stronger and more efficient paddler, Power to the Paddle

00:41:05.845 --> 00:41:09.485
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And who wouldn't mind that? So visit paddlingexercises.com to get the book and companion DVD.

00:41:48.185 --> 00:41:52.545
Thanks to Mark for sharing his plans for Oman 3165 with us and for his past

00:41:52.545 --> 00:41:56.145
adventure history as well. It'll be really interesting to follow along with

00:41:56.145 --> 00:41:58.585
Mark and learn more about his trip as it progresses.

00:41:58.945 --> 00:42:02.905
You'll find resources to connect with Mark and follow him and his team in the

00:42:02.905 --> 00:42:08.305
show notes for this episode at www.paddlingtheblue.com slash 149.

00:42:08.665 --> 00:42:12.005
Remember, if you're interested in joining me in Alaska in July of 2026,

00:42:12.185 --> 00:42:17.805
you can catch more information at www.paddlingtheblue.com slash Alaska.

00:42:18.245 --> 00:42:22.865
And if you're not already a subscriber to onlineseekhiking.com or onlinewhitewater.com,

00:42:22.865 --> 00:42:25.085
Remember that you can visit either of those two sites.

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00:42:31.905 --> 00:42:34.785
Thanks, as always, for listening, and I look forward to bringing you the next

00:42:34.785 --> 00:42:36.405
episode of Paddling the Blue.

00:42:38.205 --> 00:42:41.705
Thank you for listening to Paddling the Blue. You can subscribe to Paddling

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00:43:01.325 --> 00:43:04.485
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